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Post by imgrate on Sept 22, 2020 14:51:38 GMT -5
Going into any game in the NFL, if you told me they gave up 17 points or less I'd say you should win the game. On the other hand if you told me you're going to score 20points or less, I'd say you're probably going to lose. Defense's job is to hold them to 17 or less and offense's job is to score atleast 20. Based on my completely subjective (but probably has basis in league scoring average) criteria, I would say the defense did their job and the offense didn't. Bears held the ball for 34+ minutes. Thats on the NYGs D partly and they converted way too many first downs. The Giant D and O are equal in their level of play in most aspects. Giants offense has gained 42 first downs (7th worst in the league) while giants D has given up 37 first downs (2nd best in the league)
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Post by GameTime on Sept 22, 2020 14:52:56 GMT -5
Bears held the ball for 34+ minutes. Thats on the NYGs D partly and they converted way too many first downs. The Giant D and O are equal in their level of play in most aspects. Giants offense has gained 42 first downs (7th worst in the league) while giants D has given up 37 first downs (2nd best in the league) great.... both sides of the ball are still on the leaning curve. Not like the D is head and shoulders above the O. With that said the D has surprised me. They are playing better than I thought
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Post by Morehead State on Sept 22, 2020 15:14:34 GMT -5
Bears held the ball for 34+ minutes. Thats on the NYGs D partly and they converted way too many first downs. The Giant D and O are equal in their level of play in most aspects. Giants offense has gained 42 first downs (7th worst in the league) while giants D has given up 37 first downs (2nd best in the league) In the 1940 NFL championship game, the Bears beat the Redskins 73-0. In that game, the Redskins and Bears had the same number of first downs.
First downs may be the most irrelevant stat in the history of sports.
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Post by Morehead State on Sept 22, 2020 15:19:46 GMT -5
Fair enough, I have come to realize I'm a harsh grader. You start the game at a C and it goes from there. Given the opponent, Trubisky's struggles to throw a decent pass and the Chicago run game pretty much having its way, it didn't seem to me that the defense did anything that noteworthy yesterday other than the periods of time I mentioned. C is average, right? Defenses should start the game with an A+, because hell they haven't given up any yardage or points yet, perfect game! Opposite can be applied for offense. Since you like to start with a C, the average of those two is a C to start the game, boom! When you take an exam, do you start with an A+ because you haven't gotten any wrong yet, or a "0" because you haven't gotten any right.
The answer of course is that there is no starting point. The performance is graded as a whole, not by moving in one direction or another during the test. Same goes for a football game.
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Post by McCherry on Sept 22, 2020 15:29:50 GMT -5
NY Giants #4 overall defense!
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Post by GameTime on Sept 22, 2020 15:30:42 GMT -5
NY Giants #4 overall defense! cant argue with that
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Post by GameTime on Sept 22, 2020 15:32:44 GMT -5
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Post by imgrate on Sept 22, 2020 15:35:18 GMT -5
Giants offense has gained 42 first downs (7th worst in the league) while giants D has given up 37 first downs (2nd best in the league) In the 1940 NFL championship game, the Bears beat the Redskins 73-0. In that game, the Redskins and Bears had the same number of first downs.
First downs may be the most irrelevant stat in the history of sports.
Sure, I was just responding to what Gametime said about too many first downs.
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Post by GameTime on Sept 22, 2020 15:36:29 GMT -5
In the 1940 NFL championship game, the Bears beat the Redskins 73-0. In that game, the Redskins and Bears had the same number of first downs.
First downs may be the most irrelevant stat in the history of sports.
Sure, I was just responding to what Gametime said about too many first downs. oh..so now its my fault..lol
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Post by imgrate on Sept 22, 2020 15:36:46 GMT -5
C is average, right? Defenses should start the game with an A+, because hell they haven't given up any yardage or points yet, perfect game! Opposite can be applied for offense. Since you like to start with a C, the average of those two is a C to start the game, boom! When you take an exam, do you start with an A+ because you haven't gotten any wrong yet, or a "0" because you haven't gotten any right.
The answer of course is that there is no starting point. The performance is graded as a whole, not by moving in one direction or another during the test. Same goes for a football game.
Yea but in fantasy football your defense starts with X amount of points (whatever a shutout gets you) and your offensive players start with 0. Yes, I am being a bit goofy.
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Post by Sarcasman on Sept 22, 2020 16:41:00 GMT -5
Gameball for all of you should have been Bradberry. Nope.
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Post by Sarcasman on Sept 22, 2020 16:54:03 GMT -5
My conclusion is that Jeff can not come up with any reasons as to why that first year center in his second NFL game didn't have his hand on the ball. I'm very, very happy that Jeff is not working in the NY Giants organization. I'm even happier that Jeff thinks he knows more than al of the coaches. That's awesome and completely unsurprising coming from some rando on social media. You are making no sense but thanks for the response I think.. GO GIANTS!! Sure I am. Just because CasualFan Jeff couldn't come up with any reasons doesn't mean they don't exist. Did you watch that play and seriously think that the Giants were trying to draw the Bears offside? With the line half set and no hard count? I sure didn't. Although it could have been a very lame attempt to draw them. It could have been that they wanted to see the look the Bears D gave as is said above. It could be that Judge isn't comfortable with Gates not false starting so he was told not to touch the ball unless DJ signaled they were going. It could have been a miscommunication between the sideline and the players. What I'm saying is that I can think of multiple reasons why that play went the way it did. None of them are firm conclusions. But I ultimately have no idea why that play looked as it did. Just like Jeff. The difference is he and now probably others have decided they do know. Which is funny.
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Sept 22, 2020 16:54:54 GMT -5
After 2 games #4 326 yards a game I believe.
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Post by Sarcasman on Sept 22, 2020 16:56:48 GMT -5
Fair enough, I have come to realize I'm a harsh grader. You start the game at a C and it goes from there. Given the opponent, Trubisky's struggles to throw a decent pass and the Chicago run game pretty much having its way, it didn't seem to me that the defense did anything that noteworthy yesterday other than the periods of time I mentioned. C is average, right? Defenses should start the game with an A+, because hell they haven't given up any yardage or points yet, perfect game! Opposite can be applied for offense. Since you like to start with a C, the average of those two is a C to start the game, boom! Start the defense at A+ and the offense at F? I like it!
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Post by Kruunch on Sept 22, 2020 17:00:46 GMT -5
NY Giants #4 overall defense! How is that possible? They’re 11th in points, and 4th in yards. They’re giving up 138 yards a game on the ground. But, we have the 4th ranked defense? Maybe in our own division, not the league.
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Post by McCherry on Sept 22, 2020 17:44:22 GMT -5
NY Giants #4 overall defense! How is that possible? They’re 11th in points, and 4th in yards. They’re giving up 138 yards a game on the ground. But, we have the 4th ranked defense? Maybe in our own division, not the league. I was talking about yardage. But this post wasn't meant to be taken that seriously in week 2.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2020 6:46:42 GMT -5
You are making no sense but thanks for the response I think.. GO GIANTS!! Sure I am. Just because CasualFan Jeff couldn't come up with any reasons doesn't mean they don't exist. Did you watch that play and seriously think that the Giants were trying to draw the Bears offside? With the line half set and no hard count? I sure didn't. Although it could have been a very lame attempt to draw them. It could have been that they wanted to see the look the Bears D gave as is said above. It could be that Judge isn't comfortable with Gates not false starting so he was told not to touch the ball unless DJ signaled they were going. It could have been a miscommunication between the sideline and the players. What I'm saying is that I can think of multiple reasons why that play went the way it did. None of them are firm conclusions. But I ultimately have no idea why that play looked as it did. Just like Jeff. The difference is he and now probably others have decided they do know. Which is funny. Thanks for taking the time and effort to make a response like this!! Too funny..
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Post by Sarcasman on Sept 23, 2020 10:05:57 GMT -5
Sure I am. Just because CasualFan Jeff couldn't come up with any reasons doesn't mean they don't exist. Did you watch that play and seriously think that the Giants were trying to draw the Bears offside? With the line half set and no hard count? I sure didn't. Although it could have been a very lame attempt to draw them. It could have been that they wanted to see the look the Bears D gave as is said above. It could be that Judge isn't comfortable with Gates not false starting so he was told not to touch the ball unless DJ signaled they were going. It could have been a miscommunication between the sideline and the players. What I'm saying is that I can think of multiple reasons why that play went the way it did. None of them are firm conclusions. But I ultimately have no idea why that play looked as it did. Just like Jeff. The difference is he and now probably others have decided they do know. Which is funny. Thanks for taking the time and effort to make a response like this!! Too funny.. My pleasure. It took far less time than it took Jeffrey to re-prove the theory that a little knowledge is a dangerous but funny thing. Zomg! Gates didn’t have his hand on the ball! lmao!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2020 10:52:48 GMT -5
Thanks for taking the time and effort to make a response like this!! Too funny.. My pleasure. It took far less time than it took Jeffrey to re-prove the theory that a little knowledge is a dangerous but funny thing. Zomg! Gates didn’t have his hand on the ball! lmao! Still responding with nonsense about this I see... Thanks for the laughs! GO GIANTS!!
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Post by Sarcasman on Sept 23, 2020 11:27:29 GMT -5
My pleasure. It took far less time than it took Jeffrey to re-prove the theory that a little knowledge is a dangerous but funny thing. Zomg! Gates didn’t have his hand on the ball! lmao! Still responding with nonsense about this I see... Thanks for the laughs! GO GIANTS!! It's worth it if just one of Jeff's dimwitted followers unfollows him. The collective football IQ of the country will increase and the world would be a better place! It's a win/win, lol!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2020 11:33:49 GMT -5
Still responding with nonsense about this I see... Thanks for the laughs! GO GIANTS!! It's worth it if just one of Jeff's dimwitted followers unfollows him. The collective football IQ of the country will increase and the world would be a better place! It's a win/win, lol! Everyone needs some goals to keep them going. Never in my life would that be my choice so have at it..
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Post by Sarcasman on Sept 23, 2020 11:54:25 GMT -5
It's worth it if just one of Jeff's dimwitted followers unfollows him. The collective football IQ of the country will increase and the world would be a better place! It's a win/win, lol! Everyone needs some goals to keep them going. Never in my life would that be my choice so have at it.. That's true; I figured I'd see fewer imbeciles a day when I retired, not more. Especially unpaid ones. I forgot to factor in twitter links.
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Post by Jomo on Sept 23, 2020 13:19:58 GMT -5
Giants offense has gained 42 first downs (7th worst in the league) while giants D has given up 37 first downs (2nd best in the league) In the 1940 NFL championship game, the Bears beat the Redskins 73-0. In that game, the Redskins and Bears had the same number of first downs.
First downs may be the most irrelevant stat in the history of sports.
Turnover differential has a nice causal relationship with winning. First downs, not so much. You can say, "if you have 5 turnovers don't expect to win unless your opponent has 4 or more." It hangs together. You can't say, "if you have more first downs than your opponent you are going to win." It just doesn't follow.
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Post by jb456 on Sept 23, 2020 15:41:14 GMT -5
Is fed up a grade? And can we stop with the “we’ll win next week.” Nonsense? I heard that prior to the Steelers game, then the Bears game. Might as well go with the trifecta. We couldn’t beat the lowly Bears, that offense of theirs is pathetic. But now, we’ll beat a 49ers team that has half their roster injured. 4 straight seasons of starting off 0-2. 7 out of the last 8 years to be exact. Let that sink in.. We have become a franchise that holds moral victories above wins. And openly is thankful we aren’t the Jets. 100% agree. Watching the Giants lose so much has been so annoying and even though I was ready for it this year, It's still disgusting. It's sad but I would actually like to watch an average team at this point. 8-8 sounds like a freaking superbowl victory to me..... Every week I see these polls where 75-90% of the fans are predicting a W. No one should believe this team can win a game until they do.
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Post by giantsforce on Sept 24, 2020 13:27:24 GMT -5
I am not sure what coaching did to deserve C-! Look what they have to work with plus that they never had a regular preseason to prepare and learn who is capable of what. Yet, we are not talking how bad the play calling was and that it was not creating anything other than a dink and dunk for 3 yards as in the past. Having a real OC perhaps will be a big difference as the season progresses. I actually saw Garret coaching the QB and his Offense in the sidelines and giving them directions. How many times did we see that with Mcdoodoo or Shurmur? Mcddodoo was busy reading the Denny's menu and Shurmur was busy making the wrong calls and looking perplexed. Personally, so far I do not think coaching is the biggest problem we have. The fact that they have not had a chance to have a real offseason workouts is. You cannot evaluate talent and what they are capable of doing by holding Skype or Zoom sessions. For me, he started the game at a C and they lost. C- didn't seem unfair at all. Play calling is part of the coaching grade, I treated this like a game grade and based it solely on what I saw in this game. I also didn't give credit for effort or relativism. That doesn't mean I don't think the coaching is better this year, that just wasn't part of this game's review. I hear you and if I understand correctly you gave them C- because we of the loss. The question that I have is, did you attribute the loss on coaching? If so what else could coaching done to get this team to play better when we do not have the talent to win? Perhaps my only ding on coaching in this game would be the fact that we did not have a time out saved for the last drive. If we did, we would have another try instead of Jones having to spike the ball and lose a down. Perhaps that would have made the difference.
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Post by Sarcasman on Sept 24, 2020 14:22:40 GMT -5
For me, he started the game at a C and they lost. C- didn't seem unfair at all. Play calling is part of the coaching grade, I treated this like a game grade and based it solely on what I saw in this game. I also didn't give credit for effort or relativism. That doesn't mean I don't think the coaching is better this year, that just wasn't part of this game's review. I hear you and if I understand correctly you gave them C- because we of the loss. The question that I have is, did you attribute the loss on coaching? If so what else could coaching done to get this team to play better when we do not have the talent to win? Perhaps my only ding on coaching in this game would be the fact that we did not have a time out saved for the last drive. If we did, we would have another try instead of Jones having to spike the ball and lose a down. Perhaps that would have made the difference. Good question. That wasn't my thought process. It was really more a matter of seeing the defense do some really good things and some really crappy things. The minus was earned from my perspective from not showing up until the third drive in and then playing inconsistently overall. A timely stop - like after the Giants TD drive - would have helped.
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Post by FundamentallySoundJones on Sept 24, 2020 18:36:52 GMT -5
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Post by DandyDon on Sept 24, 2020 18:55:31 GMT -5
NY Giants #4 overall defense! Umm.. what? This team hasn't been close to 4th in anything positive in at least 3 years.
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Post by TCHOF on Sept 24, 2020 20:15:35 GMT -5
NY Giants #4 overall defense! Umm.. what? This team hasn't been close to 4th in anything positive in at least 3 years. We had the number 4 pick this year!😜
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Post by TCHOF on Sept 24, 2020 20:17:28 GMT -5
Not sure that I said it that way … but in any event, I believe that I was speaking in terms of evaluating the new coaching staff at the end of the season. While 6 wins would technically be an improvement from last year, my point was that this is not a very good team (it was probably a 6 or 7 win team before our best player got hurt) and that significant improvement shouldn't be expected this year with a new coach, new system and no offseason. That being said, we still haven't won a game and most of us are tired of hearing about some vague "improvement" spotted in losing games. We don't want to hear about "moral victories" any more - we want real victories. Obviously, this frustration is due to the last 3+ years of terrible football, the vast majority of which did not involve this current coaching staff …. True, but if we acknowledge that significant improvement shouldn't be expected at all this season, then fans shouldn't be too surprised when we lose to better teams only 2 weeks in. But we also shouldn't dismiss the fact we've been competitive and have improved noticeably just because we came up short in games we were expected to lose. The wins will come if we have any faith in this staff. Fans aren't as patient as they claim to be in the offseason. Agreed. Can’t predict a 6-7 win team and then blow a gasket every time they lose. 6-7 win teams lose a lot of games
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