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Post by 80sdreincarnate on Jan 28, 2021 15:46:49 GMT -5
Lamar is a great player, but his window will look like that of a running back. He is not a pocket passer. He can throw into big windows when the D is selling out trying to stop the run. Watson will have a much longer career as a top player. Baltimore is last by a wide margin in pass attempts since Lamar took over for Flacco. They dont run him for fun, they run because that is the strength of his game. If you force him to throw, you win. Give Lamar playmakers on the outside with the rushing attack and their defense then watch out. No one saw this coming with Lamar when the ravens drafted him. Lamar will get better inside the pocket with better weapons and a far better playbook. His running ability easily opens up the passing game. Marquise Brown and Mark Andrews would look a lot more like Kelce and Hill with a QB that can throw. And the NFL has a salary cap, the Ravens invested assets in building an offense around what Lamar does. They signed blockers for him to be able to run. They built the D. Im not going to get into a trash Lamar debate, with his legs hes a good player. If he was not allowed to run, hes a backup talent on his throwing abilities alone. If he had to face Ds playing coverages like they do for top passers, he would drown. And for that reason I'd have no interest in acquiring him if I were the Texans. Im not sold on Daniel Jones and I would not trade him straight up for Jackson.
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jay051
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Post by jay051 on Jan 28, 2021 15:57:30 GMT -5
Give Lamar playmakers on the outside with the rushing attack and their defense then watch out. No one saw this coming with Lamar when the ravens drafted him. Lamar will get better inside the pocket with better weapons and a far better playbook. His running ability easily opens up the passing game. Marquise Brown and Mark Andrews would look a lot more like Kelce and Hill with a QB that can throw. And the NFL has a salary cap, the Ravens invested assets in building an offense around what Lamar does. They signed blockers for him to be able to run. They built the D. Im not going to get into a trash Lamar debate, with his legs hes a good player. If he was not allowed to run, hes a backup talent on his throwing abilities alone. If he had to face Ds playing coverages like they do for top passers, he would drown. And for that reason I'd have no interest in acquiring him if I were the Texans. Im not sold on Daniel Jones and I would not trade him straight up for Jackson. You went too far saying Hollywood brown and Andrews would look a lot like Hill and Kelce with a better thrower. Hill and Kelce are head and above shoulders better than those two guys. Lamar doesn't have to have Mahomes throwing ability to be successful or win it all since Lamar is still an adequate thrower of the ball. RW if Im not mistaken wasn't the best thrower of the ball either but he got better as the years gone by and it showed once they gave Wilson free reigns after he won his first title. Jackson is better than some of you think but we will see over the next few years.
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Post by 80sdreincarnate on Jan 28, 2021 16:06:09 GMT -5
Marquise Brown and Mark Andrews would look a lot more like Kelce and Hill with a QB that can throw. And the NFL has a salary cap, the Ravens invested assets in building an offense around what Lamar does. They signed blockers for him to be able to run. They built the D. Im not going to get into a trash Lamar debate, with his legs hes a good player. If he was not allowed to run, hes a backup talent on his throwing abilities alone. If he had to face Ds playing coverages like they do for top passers, he would drown. And for that reason I'd have no interest in acquiring him if I were the Texans. Im not sold on Daniel Jones and I would not trade him straight up for Jackson. You went too far saying Hollywood brown and Andrews would look a lot like Hill and Kelce with a better thrower. Hill and Kelce are head and above shoulders better than those two guys. Lamar doesn't have to have Mahomes throwing ability to be successful or win it all since Lamar is still an adequate thrower of the ball. RW if Im not mistaken wasn't the best thrower of the ball either but he got better as the years gone by and it showed once they gave Wilson free reigns after he won his first title. Jackson is better than some of you think but we will see over the next few years. Russell Wilson was an excellent passer going back to college. And I did not say Brown and Andrews would be Hill and Kelce, I said they'd look more like them. Meaning if they got more targets and more accurate passes both would put up bigger stats with a good passer. Lamar is a good passer relative to 99.9% of the population. He's a bad passer relative to good passers in the NFL. And I've seen his passing stats and they stem from their rushing ability. When teams slow the Baltimore rush attack or get Lamar in a position where he has to pass his inefficiencies show up in spades. 4/4 with bad passing efforts in the playoffs. His special talent is his gifted running ability, but we see that with RBs that fades in most by their mid-20s on the top level. I liken Lamar more to RG3 and Kaepernick(both of whom were better passers), but ran gimmicky offenses catered to their legs. If Baltimore takes that offense away from him so he can throw 40 times a game it will have a negative impact on Jackson. He's in the perfect offense for his skillset.
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Post by ThatGuyRich on Jan 28, 2021 18:19:26 GMT -5
I understand from all the talking heads on TV that half the league either wants to or has contacted Houston. Of course why not ?
So many team they mention makes sense but I've just a heard a team mentioned that I hadn't thought about. The Washington team. If they trade for him with their defense and pick up a offensive player not expensive in FA. And just make solid draft picks with their other picks they could dominate the division for the immediate future.
Say they trade for Watson giving up 3 first rd picks maybe a 3rd. Now they get a RB in FA say Conners from Pitt. he won't cost that much, Washington does have a good OL. A WR in the 2nd rd. Just some more noise and another football conversation. Everybody would benefit from Watson so there is a conversation for just about any team.
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Post by ThatGuyRich on Jan 28, 2021 18:22:09 GMT -5
Washington would be interested in him. Just heard this also. This would be a pot of gold for them with that defense. They would likely dominate our division for the immediate future. Could make it thru the NFC division into a SB.
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Post by ThatGuyRich on Jan 28, 2021 18:54:34 GMT -5
Marquise Brown and Mark Andrews would look a lot more like Kelce and Hill with a QB that can throw. And the NFL has a salary cap, the Ravens invested assets in building an offense around what Lamar does. They signed blockers for him to be able to run. They built the D. Im not going to get into a trash Lamar debate, with his legs hes a good player. If he was not allowed to run, hes a backup talent on his throwing abilities alone. If he had to face Ds playing coverages like they do for top passers, he would drown. And for that reason I'd have no interest in acquiring him if I were the Texans. Im not sold on Daniel Jones and I would not trade him straight up for Jackson. You went too far saying Hollywood brown and Andrews would look a lot like Hill and Kelce with a better thrower. Hill and Kelce are head and above shoulders better than those two guys. Lamar doesn't have to have Mahomes throwing ability to be successful or win it all since Lamar is still an adequate thrower of the ball. RW if Im not mistaken wasn't the best thrower of the ball either but he got better as the years gone by and it showed once they gave Wilson free reigns after he won his first title. Jackson is better than some of you think but we will see over the next few years. As far as the Ravens go they really only have this next year coming up in their window for a SB. Next year is Jacksons 4th then the option year which is a significant jump on the rookie contract. They might have to sign Jackson to around 40 mil per year a year early. Their GM Acosta is jumping thru hoops with all their fans screaming he go after WR's in FA and the draft.
The Ravens can't keep everyone guys on the ledge they're big run stopper Williams, LBers Judon, McPhee, their RB Edwards, TE Bolin, and next year they they're are more contracts up and some will have to go. Colias Campbell, RT Brown if they keep him they might have to let LT Stanley go who just signed this year for LT money. So they have tough decisions coming up.
Jackson is going to get his money. He has all the leverage they're mediocre to pretty good without him. Their a SB challenger with him. Lamar is waiting for Dak and then he demands more.
The franchise QB's are Kings.
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Post by jimmieray on Jan 28, 2021 19:24:22 GMT -5
You went too far saying Hollywood brown and Andrews would look a lot like Hill and Kelce with a better thrower. Hill and Kelce are head and above shoulders better than those two guys. Lamar doesn't have to have Mahomes throwing ability to be successful or win it all since Lamar is still an adequate thrower of the ball. RW if Im not mistaken wasn't the best thrower of the ball either but he got better as the years gone by and it showed once they gave Wilson free reigns after he won his first title. Jackson is better than some of you think but we will see over the next few years. As far as the Ravens go they really only have this next year coming up in their window for a SB. Next year is Jacksons 4th then the option year which is a significant jump on the rookie contract. They might have to sign Jackson to around 40 mil per year a year early. Their GM Acosta is jumping thru hoops with all their fans screaming he go after WR's in FA and the draft.
The Ravens can't keep everyone guys on the ledge they're big run stopper Williams, LBers Judon, McPhee, their RB Edwards, TE Bolin, and next year they they're are more contracts up and some will have to go. Colias Campbell, RT Brown if they keep him they might have to let LT Stanley go who just signed this year for LT money. So they have tough decisions coming up.
Jackson is going to get his money. He has all the leverage they're mediocre to pretty good without him. Their a SB challenger with him. Lamar is waiting for Dak and then he demands more.
The franchise QB's are Kings.
I still figure a short career for Jackson, and he seems to wither come the playoffs. He's just too reckless with his runs, and kinda spindly. And that calm hesitation move, where everything stops after the snap with everyone waiting to see if he's handing off, taking it himself, or passing - someday teams will get fed up with that and just come full bore at him.
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Eazy E
Special Teams
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Post by Eazy E on Jan 28, 2021 20:04:07 GMT -5
A few things stand out to me. Why the hell would Watson want to go to the Jets. They are freakin awful. Cant see him wanting to go there. Watch out for a move I would absolutely hate. The Cowboys swap DAK and maybe a receiver for Watson. Would absolutely hate this move and for this reason we should put our name in the pot. He wants NY, why wouldn't he want the NYG? I think its obvious. Pick up the phone and make some noise. DJ thanks, 1st rd pick this year and next year and 1 more player either Engram or Im gonna hear it on this one. Saquan Barkley. I would put him on the block for Watson yes. As crazy as it sounds, do we really know he will be 100% Will he be 80%? Have no clue and many people don't know if he lost a step. His CAP hit is pretty big. If the Texans are willing for DJ, SB, 2 1STs then pull the trigger. All in for Watson.
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Post by giantlegacy on Jan 28, 2021 20:07:12 GMT -5
A few things stand out to me. Why the hell would Watson want to go to the Jets. They are freakin awful. Cant see him wanting to go there. Watch out for a move I would absolutely hate. The Cowboys swap DAK and maybe a receiver for Watson. Would absolutely hate this move and for this reason we should put our name in the pot. He wants NY, why wouldn't he want the NYG? I think its obvious. Pick up the phone and make some noise. DJ thanks, 1st rd pick this year and next year and 1 more player either Engram or Im gonna hear it on this one. Saquan Barkley. I would put him on the block for Watson yes. As crazy as it sounds, do we really know he will be 100% Will he be 80%? Have no clue and many people don't know if he lost a step. His CAP hit is pretty big. If the Texans are willing for DJ, SB, 2 1STs then pull the trigger. All in for Watson. You can't trade a FA (Dak)
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Eazy E
Special Teams
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Post by Eazy E on Jan 28, 2021 20:21:57 GMT -5
True you can't trade an FA but can you do a sign and trade? DAK would have to agree but he has been disrespected by his owner as well. Another thing about Barkley. Adrian Peterson has set the bar for coming back from a torn ACL and how Barkley can do the same. Would be fantastic. Has anyone looked at APs rushing stats since his injury. Only 1 1000 yd rushing season since the injury. Most ACL tears lead to players being out of the NFL in a couple of years while having a drop off in production.
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Eazy E
Special Teams
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Post by Eazy E on Jan 28, 2021 20:37:10 GMT -5
Clowney was up a few seasons ago for a sign and trade deal to the Saints. Both parties agreed but the NFL shot it down.
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jay051
Special Teams
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Post by jay051 on Jan 28, 2021 22:06:35 GMT -5
A few things stand out to me. Why the hell would Watson want to go to the Jets. They are freakin awful. Cant see him wanting to go there. Watch out for a move I would absolutely hate. The Cowboys swap DAK and maybe a receiver for Watson. Would absolutely hate this move and for this reason we should put our name in the pot. He wants NY, why wouldn't he want the NYG? I think its obvious. Pick up the phone and make some noise. DJ thanks, 1st rd pick this year and next year and 1 more player either Engram or Im gonna hear it on this one. Saquan Barkley. I would put him on the block for Watson yes. As crazy as it sounds, do we really know he will be 100% Will he be 80%? Have no clue and many people don't know if he lost a step. His CAP hit is pretty big. If the Texans are willing for DJ, SB, 2 1STs then pull the trigger. All in for Watson. No way the Texans take Saquan coming off an ACL injury.
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nyg2
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Post by nyg2 on Jan 29, 2021 9:15:01 GMT -5
LOL. Over 3 weeks later and nearly 350 replies, the mods finally decided for some reason they would move this thread from "Giants Talk" (main section of this forum) to "NFL Talk"...
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Post by snyder55 on Jan 29, 2021 9:25:52 GMT -5
If the Giants somehow got Watson they would likely have no more success than the Texans because of what they would need to sacrifice through draft capital and their lack of financial flexibility to put things around him. Watson to the Giants would IMO just make us look better losing just like the Texans look right now..
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Post by Morehead State on Jan 29, 2021 10:17:37 GMT -5
LOL. Over 3 weeks later and nearly 350 replies, the mods finally decided for some reason they would move this thread from "Giants Talk" (main section of this forum) to "NFL Talk"... I have never noticed what category a thread was in. Just go to "recent threads" and you'll be fine.
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Post by Morehead State on Jan 29, 2021 10:18:26 GMT -5
If anyone seriously thinks the Giants will get rid of Barkly or Jones or both has a serious problem. Absolutely right...because it's worked out so well for us so far.
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Post by GameTime on Jan 29, 2021 10:18:47 GMT -5
LOL. Over 3 weeks later and nearly 350 replies, the mods finally decided for some reason they would move this thread from "Giants Talk" (main section of this forum) to "NFL Talk"... why does that even matter?
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Post by Morehead State on Jan 29, 2021 10:19:47 GMT -5
LOL. Over 3 weeks later and nearly 350 replies, the mods finally decided for some reason they would move this thread from "Giants Talk" (main section of this forum) to "NFL Talk"... why does that even matter? It's obviously very important.
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nyg2
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Post by nyg2 on Jan 29, 2021 10:38:32 GMT -5
LOL. Over 3 weeks later and nearly 350 replies, the mods finally decided for some reason they would move this thread from "Giants Talk" (main section of this forum) to "NFL Talk"... why does that even matter? It doesn't, I was just pointing out that it's weird that after 3 weeks it was moved. It was simply an observation.
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Post by Morehead State on Jan 29, 2021 10:51:06 GMT -5
why does that even matter? It doesn't, I was just pointing out that it's weird that after 3 weeks it was moved. It was simply an observation. No no. It was a very important post. We are forever grateful.
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Post by JoeyCush on Jan 29, 2021 11:08:59 GMT -5
So when the Giants dont trade for Watson, is that going to be added to the list of negative things Gettleman has done? I can easily see the folks on Twitter calling for his head if he doesnt do it and how the franchise is "committed to being mediocre".
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nyg2
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Post by nyg2 on Jan 29, 2021 11:12:39 GMT -5
It doesn't, I was just pointing out that it's weird that after 3 weeks it was moved. It was simply an observation. No no. It was a very important post. We are forever grateful. It was you, wasn't it?
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Post by Morehead State on Jan 29, 2021 14:19:56 GMT -5
No no. It was a very important post. We are forever grateful. It was you, wasn't it? Actually no. As I said, I don't even notice what section a thread is in.
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Post by snyder55 on Jan 29, 2021 16:24:35 GMT -5
apparently he wants his input for the GM and staff considered (would he like Gettleman or Judge?) If he actually thinks his input on the GM should matter then he needs a new block diagram of the hierarchy of an NFL franchise is structured. Having a casual conversation about it with ownership is one thing but to be upset they didn't bring in any of the people you mentioned is ridiculous on his part. . I know things are different in the league now than when I remember but since when does a player tell the team who the GM should be and then get pissed if they don't ask him..
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Post by snyder55 on Jan 29, 2021 16:29:57 GMT -5
Watson is certainly a good QB but just like Jones he isn't good enough to carry a team to a win when the team sucks, just goes to show you how much a team needs a very good WR...
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Post by GameTime on Jan 29, 2021 16:31:23 GMT -5
apparently he wants his input for the GM and staff considered (would he like Gettleman or Judge?) If he actually thinks his input on the GM should matter then he needs a new block diagram of the hierarchy of an NFL franchise is structured. Having a casual conversation about it with ownership is one thing but to be upset they didn't bring in any of the people you mentioned is ridiculous on his part. . I know things are different in the league now than when I remember but since when does a player tell the team who the GM should be and then get pissed if they don't ask him.. agreed......beyond that team is a mess anyway. I am sure he'd love get out of there anyway.
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te88
Special Teams
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Post by te88 on Jan 29, 2021 16:33:15 GMT -5
If I were Houston I would simply tell Watson that he is playing for me or he is playing for no one.
Sorry too good of a player to send him somewhere else so that he can kill you every time you play him.
Either you want to play football or not. I would be fine with losing him for nothing if he decides to quit
The Texans would never recover if they trade him
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Post by ThatGuyRich on Jan 29, 2021 17:15:59 GMT -5
As far as the Ravens go they really only have this next year coming up in their window for a SB. Next year is Jacksons 4th then the option year which is a significant jump on the rookie contract. They might have to sign Jackson to around 40 mil per year a year early. Their GM Acosta is jumping thru hoops with all their fans screaming he go after WR's in FA and the draft.
The Ravens can't keep everyone guys on the ledge they're big run stopper Williams, LBers Judon, McPhee, their RB Edwards, TE Bolin, and next year they they're are more contracts up and some will have to go. Colias Campbell, RT Brown if they keep him they might have to let LT Stanley go who just signed this year for LT money. So they have tough decisions coming up.
Jackson is going to get his money. He has all the leverage they're mediocre to pretty good without him. Their a SB challenger with him. Lamar is waiting for Dak and then he demands more.
The franchise QB's are Kings.
I still figure a short career for Jackson, and he seems to wither come the playoffs. He's just too reckless with his runs, and kinda spindly. And that calm hesitation move, where everything stops after the snap with everyone waiting to see if he's handing off, taking it himself, or passing - someday teams will get fed up with that and just come full bore at him. Yea I know maybe your right I said that his first year and the first half of his 2nd year. then you come to the conclusion just let him do it his way. But he's just so damn fast it looks as though the defense is just a couple steps slower. He can change direction without slowing down, I think his secret is his vision of the field ahead of everyone else. But the Ravens must tie him up and whatever comes ? Comes.
The Ravens should contend as long as Jackson can run.
But the Raven offense needs that A-1 receiver with deep speed. Not Hollywood he could be a very good #2 maybe. He's not a #1. If their going to compete with Mahomes and K.C. they need that passing game to go with their dominant run game.
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Post by giantlegacy on Jan 29, 2021 18:05:20 GMT -5
I still figure a short career for Jackson, and he seems to wither come the playoffs. He's just too reckless with his runs, and kinda spindly. And that calm hesitation move, where everything stops after the snap with everyone waiting to see if he's handing off, taking it himself, or passing - someday teams will get fed up with that and just come full bore at him. Yea I know maybe your right I said that his first year and the first half of his 2nd year. then you come to the conclusion just let him do it his way. But he's just so damn fast it looks as though the defense is just a couple steps slower. He can change direction without slowing down, I think his secret is his vision of the field ahead of everyone else. But the Ravens must tie him up and whatever comes ? Comes.
The Ravens should contend as long as Jackson can run.
But the Raven offense needs that A-1 receiver with deep speed. Not Hollywood he could be a very good #2 maybe. He's not a #1. If their going to compete with Mahomes and K.C. they need that passing game to go with their dominant run game.
They added weapons this offseason and draft The problem is Greg Roman has zero clue how to build a modern NFL Passing attack which unfortunately doesn't allow Jackson to go through all his progressions ..
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Post by ThatGuyRich on Jan 29, 2021 18:20:12 GMT -5
Yea I know maybe your right I said that his first year and the first half of his 2nd year. then you come to the conclusion just let him do it his way. But he's just so damn fast it looks as though the defense is just a couple steps slower. He can change direction without slowing down, I think his secret is his vision of the field ahead of everyone else. But the Ravens must tie him up and whatever comes ? Comes.
The Ravens should contend as long as Jackson can run.
But the Raven offense needs that A-1 receiver with deep speed. Not Hollywood he could be a very good #2 maybe. He's not a #1. If their going to compete with Mahomes and K.C. they need that passing game to go with their dominant run game.
They added weapons this offseason and draft The problem is Greg Roman has zero clue how to build a modern NFL Passing attack which unfortunately doesn't allow Jackson to go through all his progressions .. GL you are 100% correct about Greg Roman. This is an issue.
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