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Post by cdngfan on Nov 1, 2021 12:24:03 GMT -5
First off, I’m not a Gettleman hater.
I posted in another thread that we’d probably need a winning record for him to survive.
But with the remaining schedule, unless we almost run the table, I don’t know if even that’s enough.
I can see us getting to 8 wins, but that’s from beating up on the other losers of the NFL. Is that enough to save DG? Some would say that’s 6-5 over the last 11 games, but none against teams with winning records so far (except the panthers).
So to get to 9 we have to be perfect against the losers and get an upset against a winning team.
Maybe that’s enough. That gives you (probably) 3-4 wins over winning teams and 6-7 against losing teams.
Even with that I could see it going either way.
Maybe if Thomas and DJ keep elevating their games, long term solutions at QB and LT and a winning record might be enough.
Just not a lot of scenarios where you give DG another 3+ years.
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Post by Morehead State on Nov 1, 2021 12:26:44 GMT -5
First off, I’m not a Gettleman hater. I posted in another thread that we’d probably need a winning record for him to survive. But with the remaining schedule, unless we almost run the table, I don’t know if even that’s enough. I can see us getting to 8 wins, but that’s from beating up on the other losers of the NFL. Is that enough to save DG? Some would say that’s 6-5 over the last 11 games, but none against teams with winning records so far (except the panthers). So to get to 9 we have to be perfect against the losers and gets upset against a winning team. Maybe that’s enough. That gives you (probably) 3 wins over winning teams and 7 against losing teams. Even with that I could see it going either way. Maybe if Thomas and DJ keep elevating their games, long term solutions at QB and LT and a winning record might be enough. Just not a lot of scenarios where you give DG another 3+ years. John Mara is looking for ANY excuse to keep continuity here. If we continue to lose he will keep Dave unless there is so much uproar, he has no choice.
It doesn't matter that we lose. It doesn't matter than we are the worst team in the NFL over the last 4 seasons.
Keeping or getting rid of Dave has nothing to do with anything except the cob webs in John Mara's head.
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Post by Parademon1 on Nov 1, 2021 12:46:20 GMT -5
With all the top draft picks we have in 22', finishing with a 500 or better record only hurts us. If we can play competitive football the rest of the yr & finish 5-12, that gives us a top 6 pick & hopefully the Bears finish with a record that guarantees them a top 10 pick which would be ours if I'm not mistaken, that means we could have 2 top 10 picks. Go OL/DL with those 2 picks, then get best LBer available with #2 pick then best DL/OL with 3rd pick, then best DB with #4 pick, then OL/DL with #5 , #6 picks. IMO, we do not need any offensive weapons next yr in the draft, should be nothing but trench positions.
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Post by Rangers13 on Nov 1, 2021 12:46:50 GMT -5
Idk about surviving but my sources tell me the Titans are looking to offer a #1 pick for Barkley yet Gettleman won’t answer the phone.
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Post by giantlegacy on Nov 1, 2021 12:53:00 GMT -5
First off, I’m not a Gettleman hater. I posted in another thread that we’d probably need a winning record for him to survive. But with the remaining schedule, unless we almost run the table, I don’t know if even that’s enough. I can see us getting to 8 wins, but that’s from beating up on the other losers of the NFL. Is that enough to save DG? Some would say that’s 6-5 over the last 11 games, but none against teams with winning records so far (except the panthers). So to get to 9 we have to be perfect against the losers and gets upset against a winning team. Maybe that’s enough. That gives you (probably) 3 wins over winning teams and 7 against losing teams. Even with that I could see it going either way. Maybe if Thomas and DJ keep elevating their games, long term solutions at QB and LT and a winning record might be enough. Just not a lot of scenarios where you give DG another 3+ years. John Mara is looking for ANY excuse to keep continuity here. If we continue to lose he will keep Dave unless there is so much uproar, he has no choice.
It doesn't matter that we lose. It doesn't matter than we are the worst team in the NFL over the last 4 seasons.
Keeping or getting rid of Dave has nothing to do with anything except the cob webs in John Mara's head.
He can do the same exact thing by having a sham of an interview process knowing Abrams already is the heir apparent
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Nov 1, 2021 12:54:07 GMT -5
First off, I’m not a Gettleman hater. I posted in another thread that we’d probably need a winning record for him to survive. But with the remaining schedule, unless we almost run the table, I don’t know if even that’s enough. I can see us getting to 8 wins, but that’s from beating up on the other losers of the NFL. Is that enough to save DG? Some would say that’s 6-5 over the last 11 games, but none against teams with winning records so far (except the panthers). So to get to 9 we have to be perfect against the losers and get an upset against a winning team. Maybe that’s enough. That gives you (probably) 3-4 wins over winning teams and 6-7 against losing teams. Even with that I could see it going either way. Maybe if Thomas and DJ keep elevating their games, long term solutions at QB and LT and a winning record might be enough. Just not a lot of scenarios where you give DG another 3+ years. they beat the Saints these 2 years they have beaten more winning teams then they have since 2013 Seahawks Saints and Panthers see if they can stack up a few more from mid season last year to now.
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Post by McCherry on Nov 1, 2021 12:54:18 GMT -5
He's going to be 71 this offseason. There is more to consider here than just this season's results. He may have been planning to leave anyway.
Promoting Abrams IS keeping continuity.
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Post by Roosevelt on Nov 1, 2021 12:54:52 GMT -5
First off, I’m not a Gettleman hater. I posted in another thread that we’d probably need a winning record for him to survive. But with the remaining schedule, unless we almost run the table, I don’t know if even that’s enough. I can see us getting to 8 wins, but that’s from beating up on the other losers of the NFL. Is that enough to save DG? Some would say that’s 6-5 over the last 11 games, but none against teams with winning records so far (except the panthers). So to get to 9 we have to be perfect against the losers and gets upset against a winning team. Maybe that’s enough. That gives you (probably) 3 wins over winning teams and 7 against losing teams. Even with that I could see it going either way. Maybe if Thomas and DJ keep elevating their games, long term solutions at QB and LT and a winning record might be enough. Just not a lot of scenarios where you give DG another 3+ years. John Mara is looking for ANY excuse to keep continuity here. If we continue to lose he will keep Dave unless there is so much uproar, he has no choice.
It doesn't matter that we lose. It doesn't matter than we are the worst team in the NFL over the last 4 seasons.
Keeping or getting rid of Dave has nothing to do with anything except the cob webs in John Mara's head.
I believe John is committed to doing what he feels is in the best interest of the Giants. Continuity is and should be a factor as we've all seen what impatience looks like with various organizations.
The collapse of the Giants in 2013 was anything but typical of a team with a 2x Super Bowl winning GM, HC, and QB. And yet there they were struggling to salvage their HOF QB's career and get their team back on track.
And here we are today, 4 coaches and 2 GM's later, with almost the entire starting offense injured throughout this season, with a need to blame John Mara for not caring about his team?
I think Dave will retire. He had his run. The question is who will take over; Kevin Abram's or do they dare to shake things up?
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Nov 1, 2021 12:56:47 GMT -5
John Mara is looking for ANY excuse to keep continuity here. If we continue to lose he will keep Dave unless there is so much uproar, he has no choice.
It doesn't matter that we lose. It doesn't matter than we are the worst team in the NFL over the last 4 seasons.
Keeping or getting rid of Dave has nothing to do with anything except the cob webs in John Mara's head.
He can do the same exact thing by having a sham of an interview process knowing Abrams already is the heir apparent From what I have been reading is team execs around the league believe the Giants are compiling info on GM candidates outside candidates. still doesn't do it for me I want someone outside helping fix this mess while helping find the next leader of the franchise.
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Post by giantlegacy on Nov 1, 2021 12:57:59 GMT -5
He can do the same exact thing by having a sham of an interview process knowing Abrams already is the heir apparent From what I have been reading is team execs around the league believe the Giants are compiling info on GM candidates outside candidates. still doesn't do it for me I want someone outside helping fix this mess while helping find the next leader of the franchise. To run their sham of a GM search
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Nov 1, 2021 13:02:18 GMT -5
John Mara is looking for ANY excuse to keep continuity here. If we continue to lose he will keep Dave unless there is so much uproar, he has no choice.
It doesn't matter that we lose. It doesn't matter than we are the worst team in the NFL over the last 4 seasons.
Keeping or getting rid of Dave has nothing to do with anything except the cob webs in John Mara's head.
I believe John is committed to doing what he feels is in the best interest of the Giants. Continuity is and should be a factor as we've all seen what impatience looks like with various organizations.
The collapse of the Giants in 2013 was anything but typical of a team with a 2x Super Bowl winning GM, HC, and QB. And yet there they were struggling to salvage their HOF QB's career and get their team back on track.
And here we are today, 4 coaches and 2 GM's later, with almost the entire starting offense injured throughout this season, with a need to blame John Mara for not caring about his team?
I think Dave will retire. He had his run. The question is who will take over; Kevin Abram's or do they dare to shake things up?
If you look at the Rams Les Snead I believe had 5 losing season while building the team back up, since 3 playoff appearances and one Super Bowl loss and it looks like they will be vying fro another visit to the big game. that is one and one of the only ones where a team stuck it out three reward has been success can Gettlemen do this I don't know. The Rams were worse then the Giants in 2016 the Giants beat them all tho it was close it was the end Jeff fishers coaching career.
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Nov 1, 2021 13:03:09 GMT -5
From what I have been reading is team execs around the league believe the Giants are compiling info on GM candidates outside candidates. still doesn't do it for me I want someone outside helping fix this mess while helping find the next leader of the franchise. To run their sham of a GM search I'm gonna hold out hope lol.
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Nov 1, 2021 13:10:41 GMT -5
First off, I’m not a Gettleman hater. I posted in another thread that we’d probably need a winning record for him to survive. But with the remaining schedule, unless we almost run the table, I don’t know if even that’s enough. I can see us getting to 8 wins, but that’s from beating up on the other losers of the NFL. Is that enough to save DG? Some would say that’s 6-5 over the last 11 games, but none against teams with winning records so far (except the panthers). So to get to 9 we have to be perfect against the losers and get an upset against a winning team. Maybe that’s enough. That gives you (probably) 3-4 wins over winning teams and 6-7 against losing teams. Even with that I could see it going either way. Maybe if Thomas and DJ keep elevating their games, long term solutions at QB and LT and a winning record might be enough. Just not a lot of scenarios where you give DG another 3+ years. Winning 7 or 8 of the next 10 games might do it Mara wants continuity and a winning record 9-8 or 10-7 would go a long way towards him talking himself into keeping DG around or letting him walk on his own terms and doing there Giants thing elevating Pettit or Abrems. Not what I would want but who am I it's Johns money to burn.
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FBomb
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Post by FBomb on Nov 1, 2021 13:14:21 GMT -5
I think G retires, for health reasons, at the end of the season regardless of the record. If it winds up being a terrible record and things haven't improved, Mara will promote Abrams for one last attempt to try and salvage Jones and Judge's careers. After that and it isn't any better, he scraps the entire thing an starts over. Again.
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Post by vinnie on Nov 1, 2021 13:18:11 GMT -5
First off, I’m not a Gettleman hater. I posted in another thread that we’d probably need a winning record for him to survive. But with the remaining schedule, unless we almost run the table, I don’t know if even that’s enough. I can see us getting to 8 wins, but that’s from beating up on the other losers of the NFL. Is that enough to save DG? Some would say that’s 6-5 over the last 11 games, but none against teams with winning records so far (except the panthers). So to get to 9 we have to be perfect against the losers and get an upset against a winning team. Maybe that’s enough. That gives you (probably) 3-4 wins over winning teams and 6-7 against losing teams. Even with that I could see it going either way. Maybe if Thomas and DJ keep elevating their games, long term solutions at QB and LT and a winning record might be enough. Just not a lot of scenarios where you give DG another 3+ years. It's sad that many have to preface their opinion with, "I"m not a ------- hater" just so there isn't backlash from the pitchforked mob. To the point: Even if the Giants pull off a typical 5-3 "great" ending to the season I think the damage is already done given the four year observance and results. No way Gettleman doesn't retire at the end of the season. I thought the exact same thing as soon as a I read that. It’s pathetic that anyone who criticizes a GM who has fielded the worst team in the league for 4+ years is considered a “hater”. I could flip it and question anyone who supports him whether they are a true Giants fan because the results tell you all you need to know.
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Post by vinnie on Nov 1, 2021 13:20:05 GMT -5
I believe John is committed to doing what he feels is in the best interest of the Giants. Continuity is and should be a factor as we've all seen what impatience looks like with various organizations.
The collapse of the Giants in 2013 was anything but typical of a team with a 2x Super Bowl winning GM, HC, and QB. And yet there they were struggling to salvage their HOF QB's career and get their team back on track.
And here we are today, 4 coaches and 2 GM's later, with almost the entire starting offense injured throughout this season, with a need to blame John Mara for not caring about his team?
I think Dave will retire. He had his run. The question is who will take over; Kevin Abram's or do they dare to shake things up?
If you look at the Rams Les Snead I believe had 5 losing season while building the team back up, since 3 playoff appearances and one Super Bowl loss and it looks like they will be vying fro another visit to the big game. that is one and one of the only ones where a team stuck it out three reward has been success can Gettlemen do this I don't know. The Rams were worse then the Giants in 2016 the Giants beat them all tho it was close it was the end Jeef whats his fishers coaching career. Being lazy, any idea how many of those 5 losing seasons were under McVay?
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Post by spaceweather on Nov 1, 2021 13:25:30 GMT -5
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FBomb
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Post by FBomb on Nov 1, 2021 13:29:04 GMT -5
It's sad that many have to preface their opinion with, "I"m not a ------- hater" just so there isn't backlash from the pitchforked mob. To the point: Even if the Giants pull off a typical 5-3 "great" ending to the season I think the damage is already done given the four year observance and results. No way Gettleman doesn't retire at the end of the season. I thought the exact same thing as soon as a I read that. It’s pathetic that anyone who criticizes a GM who has fielded the worst team in the league for 4+ years is considered a “hater”. I could flip it and question anyone who supports him whether they are a true Giants fan because the results tell you all you need to know. So ridiculous. The same people whining about being called a hater are the same ones that pounce on anyone who has anything positive to say. And I'm NOT "optimistic" about most of the goings on. I think DG is a bad GM and I think Judge is all talk at this point. So I don't have a bias in the argument. Both sides do it and whine about the other and the problem just repeats itself over and over. How about both sides move on and let everyone have their own opinions without being insulted for it? And before anyone points the finger at me, I don't insult people for their opinions, I insult people for acting like an asshat.
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FBomb
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Post by FBomb on Nov 1, 2021 13:32:25 GMT -5
There's everyone else's opinion, and then there's Mara's.
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Post by giantlegacy on Nov 1, 2021 13:34:23 GMT -5
There's everyone else's opinion, and then there's Mara's. As long as Fredo is in his position any GM will have to answer to him... Meaning it's going to be an in house promotion
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Post by Giggles on Nov 1, 2021 13:37:01 GMT -5
Watching the Cowboys last night we are years away from competing with them. Gettleman will not survive but I'm afraid Judge will be forced on the new GM
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FBomb
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Post by FBomb on Nov 1, 2021 13:38:18 GMT -5
There's everyone else's opinion, and then there's Mara's. As long as Fredo is in his position any GM will have to answer to him... Meaning it's going to be an in house promotion Yep. He's going to give it one more year with DJ and Judge. That means continuity. If next season we crash and burn, then he will hopefully have an epiphany and realize that he just sucks. He just does.
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jerky
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Post by jerky on Nov 1, 2021 13:43:03 GMT -5
If you look at the Rams Les Snead I believe had 5 losing season while building the team back up, since 3 playoff appearances and one Super Bowl loss and it looks like they will be vying fro another visit to the big game. that is one and one of the only ones where a team stuck it out three reward has been success can Gettlemen do this I don't know. The Rams were worse then the Giants in 2016 the Giants beat them all tho it was close it was the end Jeef whats his fishers coaching career. Being lazy, any idea how many of those 5 losing seasons were under McVay? Les Snead started with the Rams in 2012, McVay started with the Rams in 2017 2012: 7-8-1 2013: 7-9 2014: 6-10 2015: 7-9 2016: 4-12 2017: 11-5 2018: 13-3 2019: 9-7 2020: 10-6
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Post by repeatchamps on Nov 1, 2021 13:49:05 GMT -5
Watching the Cowboys last night we are years away from competing with them. Gettleman will not survive but I'm afraid Judge will be forced on the new GM I was unimpressed with Dallas last night so not sure what you were watching. Yes I know they had a back up QB playing but the Vikings are horrid and Dallas barely squeaked by. Yesterday was not the game to gauge how far away we are from competing with Dallas. It may be true but yesterday's game was not the example to use. Last I looked also a fully healthy Dallas also barely squeaked by San Diego and New England (pretty much all luck that they got wins in those 2 games) as well and those teams are middle of the pack at best right now.
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Nov 1, 2021 13:53:29 GMT -5
If you look at the Rams Les Snead I believe had 5 losing season while building the team back up, since 3 playoff appearances and one Super Bowl loss and it looks like they will be vying fro another visit to the big game. that is one and one of the only ones where a team stuck it out three reward has been success can Gettlemen do this I don't know. The Rams were worse then the Giants in 2016 the Giants beat them all tho it was close it was the end Jeef whats his fishers coaching career. Being lazy, any idea how many of those 5 losing seasons were under McVay? 0 in 2017 he came to Giants stadium and embarrassed them worse then he did this year much worse, That has 0 to do with it he was gonna be the GM for a sixth year with or without McVay in his sixth year he hired Mcvay the only thing for sure is Fischer wasn't gonna be the coach. I think Gettlemen has had enough time if they don't have a winning record by years end he should be gone, if he does win I can see them giving him another year if he wants one. For him to survive they got a lot of digging to do
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Nov 1, 2021 13:55:09 GMT -5
Watching the Cowboys last night we are years away from competing with them. Gettleman will not survive but I'm afraid Judge will be forced on the new GM I was unimpressed with Dallas last night so not sure what you were watching. Yes I know they had a back up QB playing but the Vikings are horrid and Dallas barely squeaked by. Yesterday was not the game to gauge how far away we are from competing with Dallas. It may be true but yesterday's game was not the example to use. Last I looked also a fully healthy Dallas also barely squeaked by San Diego and New England (pretty much all luck that they got wins in those 2 games) as well and those teams are middle of the pack at best right now. Viking offense isn't very good they have had a # of games like that this year, there egame plan was a joke 500 screens.
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jerky
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Post by jerky on Nov 1, 2021 13:56:14 GMT -5
I have a question for anyone here. A lot of people mention that most NFL teams can turn around relatively quickly (maybe 2 years) from being a bad team to a good team. Do most NFL teams have a complete lack of talent that the Giants had when Gettleman took over as GM? He basically had to start from scratch, we had maybe a handful of starters and no depth.
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FBomb
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Post by FBomb on Nov 1, 2021 13:59:25 GMT -5
I have a question for anyone here. A lot of people mention that most NFL teams can turn around relatively quickly (maybe 2 years) from being a bad team to a good team. Do most NFL teams have a complete lack of talent that the Giants had when Gettleman took over as GM? He basically had to start from scratch, we had maybe a handful of starters and no depth. The problem is that we haven't improved at all. We have the worst win loss record in the NFL over the last 4 years. How much time should we give him? Also, I LOVE Barkley, but that pick has been a disaster for the Giants. That's on Dave
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Post by Morehead State on Nov 1, 2021 14:00:14 GMT -5
Watching the Cowboys last night we are years away from competing with them. Gettleman will not survive but I'm afraid Judge will be forced on the new GM I was unimpressed with Dallas last night so not sure what you were watching. Yes I know they had a back up QB playing but the Vikings are horrid and Dallas barely squeaked by. Yesterday was not the game to gauge how far away we are from competing with Dallas. It may be true but yesterday's game was not the example to use. Last I looked also a fully healthy Dallas also barely squeaked by San Diego and New England (pretty much all luck that they got wins in those 2 games) as well and those teams are middle of the pack at best right now. Wouldn't it be nice if we started "squeaking" past teams.
You know another word for "squeaking by" teams?,.............."Winning".
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Nov 1, 2021 14:00:23 GMT -5
There's everyone else's opinion, and then there's Mara's. He writes the check would have to agree with this, they should be doing their work its' last year on his current contract I believe and wether they want him or not he might retire. sounds like they are canvasing outside talent it can all be BS usually where theres smoke theres fire.
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