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Post by TheAnalyst on Nov 8, 2019 11:00:16 GMT -5
What are your thoughts on this?
Both teams got new HCs (Shurmur/Gruden), new GMs (Gettleman/Mayock), traded away great talent (OBJ/Cooper and Vernon/Mack)....
Yet the Raiders are the ones showing improvement while the NY Giants are not. This is what is disappointing to me. They moved to 5-4 last night. Look respectable. We are 2-7 and look terrible.
So why do you guys think the Raiders rebuild is working much better/quicker than the Giants rebuild as of now?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 8, 2019 11:06:18 GMT -5
What are your thoughts on this? Both teams got new HCs (Shurmur/Gruden), new GMs (Gettleman/Mayock), traded away great talent (OBJ/Cooper and Vernon/Mack).... Yet the Raiders are the ones showing improvement while the NY Giants are not. This is what is disappointing to me. They moved to 5-4 last night. Look respectable. We are 2-7 and look terrible. So why do you guys think the Raiders rebuild is working much better/quicker than the Giants rebuild as of now? Good question.. This comparison ruins the "it takes 3 to 4 years minimum to rebuild a team like this" I still think the Barkley pick should've been traded for 3 to 4 high draft picks instead of one player. It's worked out great for the Colts. We can only hope that next years FAs are better than advertised and the draft picks are more NFL ready then the norm. |
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Post by scoostraw on Nov 8, 2019 11:07:50 GMT -5
What are your thoughts on this? Both teams got new HCs (Shurmur/Gruden), new GMs (Gettleman/Mayock), traded away great talent (OBJ/Cooper and Vernon/Mack).... Yet the Raiders are the ones showing improvement while the NY Giants are not. This is what is disappointing to me. They moved to 5-4 last night. Look respectable. We are 2-7 and look terrible. So why do you guys think the Raiders rebuild is working much better/quicker than the Giants rebuild as of now? Competent coaching and game management. |
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Post by shocknaweny on Nov 8, 2019 11:08:55 GMT -5
What are your thoughts on this? Both teams got new HCs (Shurmur/Gruden), new GMs (Gettleman/Mayock), traded away great talent (OBJ/Cooper and Vernon/Mack).... Yet the Raiders are the ones showing improvement while the NY Giants are not. This is what is disappointing to me. They moved to 5-4 last night. Look respectable. We are 2-7 and look terrible. So why do you guys think the Raiders rebuild is working much better/quicker than the Giants rebuild as of now? Good question.. This comparison ruins the "it takes 3 to 4 years minimum to rebuild a team like this" I still think the Barkley pick should've been traded for 3 to 4 high draft picks instead of one player. It's worked out great for the Colts. We can only hope that next years FAs are better than advertised and the draft picks are more NFL ready then the norm. maybe that's what we will do this time around |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 8, 2019 11:10:06 GMT -5
Mayock looks to have had one of the best drafts in recent memory
Combined with superior coaching there you have it.
Gruden is a SB champion. Pat Shurmur is 17-40
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Post by Shim on Nov 8, 2019 11:10:16 GMT -5
QB and OL continuity over in OAK as opposed to the NYG.
Plus I would take Gruden in a heartbeat over Shurmur any ****ing day. Gruden at least knows how to use his rookie weapons.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 8, 2019 11:11:41 GMT -5
Mayock looks to have had one of the best drafts in recent memory Combined with superior coaching there you have it. Gruden is a SB champion. Pat Shurmur is 17-40 Oakland has also put together one of if not the best OLs in The league this year. Coaching... |
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Post by GameTime on Nov 8, 2019 11:12:39 GMT -5
What are your thoughts on this? Both teams got new HCs (Shurmur/Gruden), new GMs (Gettleman/Mayock), traded away great talent (OBJ/Cooper and Vernon/Mack).... Yet the Raiders are the ones showing improvement while the NY Giants are not. This is what is disappointing to me. They moved to 5-4 last night. Look respectable. We are 2-7 and look terrible. So why do you guys think the Raiders rebuild is working much better/quicker than the Giants rebuild as of now? Carr > Jones Betcher stinks so far Gruden> Shurmur not hard to see why the Raiders are better at this point |
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Post by giantlegacy on Nov 8, 2019 11:12:45 GMT -5
Gruden also resurrected their franchise qb,so no recourses were needed for a qb
Remember,they reached for Ferrell and it's working out great for them
If anything most of us were wrong about Gruden
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Post by giantlegacy on Nov 8, 2019 11:14:33 GMT -5
Mayock looks to have had one of the best drafts in recent memory Combined with superior coaching there you have it. Gruden is a SB champion. Pat Shurmur is 17-40 Yeah We all thought the Raiders were nuts... This is why Mayock was always spot on at NFL network as opposed to ybe twin twits at ESPN |
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Post by TheAnalyst on Nov 8, 2019 11:17:33 GMT -5
Yup. Most here (not everyone though) said hell no to Gruden being the HC here and thought Derek Carr was not a good QB. Im just not sold on the GM or coaches here. And that is a major issue.
And its not like the Giants have the distraction of being moved to Vegas either.
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Post by giantlegacy on Nov 8, 2019 11:20:07 GMT -5
Yup. Most here (not everyone though) said hell no to Gruden being the HC here and thought Derek Carr was not a good QB. Im just not sold on the GM or coaches here. And that is a major issue. And its not like the Giants have the distraction of being moved to Vegas either. He still has more to work with there though. |
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Post by GameTime on Nov 8, 2019 11:20:13 GMT -5
Yup. Most here (not everyone though) said hell no to Gruden being the HC here and thought Derek Carr was not a good QB. Im just not sold on the GM or coaches here. And that is a major issue. I am still not sold on Gruden having big success at this point in his NFL career an Carr could still go either way. Right now its working to a degree for them but its not a slam dunk that they are "back" at all. Then they move to Vegas and that in itself will be a shit a show for the NFL. One more step to this sport becoming a spectacle in a negative way IMO. |
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Post by krappdetector on Nov 8, 2019 11:35:53 GMT -5
Good question.. This comparison ruins the "it takes 3 to 4 years minimum to rebuild a team like this" I still think the Barkley pick should've been traded for 3 to 4 high draft picks instead of one player. It's worked out great for the Colts. We can only hope that next years FAs are better than advertised and the draft picks are more NFL ready then the norm. maybe that's what we will do this time around Jeez, I hope so. Let's just pray that there isn't a punter touched by the hand of god. |
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Post by NAVY2323(ret) on Nov 8, 2019 11:44:11 GMT -5
My opinion is that Gruden is a proven winner and Shurmur is a proven loser. Count me as not surprised.
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Post by Speedman on Nov 8, 2019 11:45:56 GMT -5
The Giants should have moved on from OBJ the year before. Could have gotten a couple of Cleveland’s top picks in that year. Rebuild process would have been on an earlier course.
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Post by TEM on Nov 8, 2019 12:13:04 GMT -5
What are your thoughts on this? Both teams got new HCs (Shurmur/Gruden), new GMs (Gettleman/Mayock), traded away great talent (OBJ/Cooper and Vernon/Mack).... Yet the Raiders are the ones showing improvement while the NY Giants are not. This is what is disappointing to me. They moved to 5-4 last night. Look respectable. We are 2-7 and look terrible. So why do you guys think the Raiders rebuild is working much better/quicker than the Giants rebuild as of now? The raiders did not dismantle their entire team . Still on the Raiders from 2017 25% retention Reggie Nelson Karl Joseph Nicholas Morrow Dexter McDonald Justin Ellis Marquel Lee DeAndre Washington Jalen Richard Keith McGill Rodney Hudson Derrick Carr Maurice Hurst Gabe Jackson Still on the Giants from 2017 17 % retention Eli Jack rabbit Wayne Gallman Rhett Ellison Zak DeOssie Jon Halapio Dalvin Tomlinson Sterling Shepard Evan Engram The Raiders had 72 million in cap space this past off season. The Giants had 23 million The Giants are starting a rookie QB. |
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Post by Kruunch on Nov 8, 2019 12:18:23 GMT -5
Yup. Most here (not everyone though) said hell no to Gruden being the HC here and thought Derek Carr was not a good QB. Im just not sold on the GM or coaches here. And that is a major issue. And its not like the Giants have the distraction of being moved to Vegas either. Mara would have never hired Gruden here. Make no mistake, Gruden is the GM in Oakland, not Mayock. And I don’t think Mara will ever give a head coach that much power with his team. As for Gruden, great X’s and O’s coach. I was in Dunedin Florida when he was the Bucs coach. At the end of his tenure the fans hated him.. He would alienate fan favorites, and it’s his way or the highway. It would have never have worked here. I actually met him years back in Tampa. Nice guy.. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 8, 2019 12:22:28 GMT -5
What are your thoughts on this? Both teams got new HCs (Shurmur/Gruden), new GMs (Gettleman/Mayock), traded away great talent (OBJ/Cooper and Vernon/Mack).... Yet the Raiders are the ones showing improvement while the NY Giants are not. This is what is disappointing to me. They moved to 5-4 last night. Look respectable. We are 2-7 and look terrible. So why do you guys think the Raiders rebuild is working much better/quicker than the Giants rebuild as of now? The raiders did not dismantle their entire team . Still on the Raiders from 2017 25% retention Reggie Nelson Karl Joseph Nicholas Morrow Dexter McDonald Justin Ellis Marquel Lee DeAndre Washington Jalen Richard Keith McGill Rodney Hudson Derrick Carr Maurice Hurst Gabe Jackson Still on the Giants from 2017 17 % retention Eli Jack rabbit Wayne Gallman Rhett Ellison Zak DeOssie Jon Halapio Dalvin Tomlinson Sterling Shepard Evan Engram The Raiders had 72 million in cap space this past off season. The Giants had 23 million The Giants are starting a rookie QB. This +1000. Also, Gruden is a seasoned SB winning coach. Shurmur seems as if he's learning as he goes. |
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Post by Delicreep on Nov 8, 2019 12:36:31 GMT -5
When did rebuilding a team get defined as a new GM and coach?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 8, 2019 12:39:52 GMT -5
When did rebuilding a team get defined as a new GM and coach?  |
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Post by Delicreep on Nov 8, 2019 12:41:39 GMT -5
When did rebuilding a team get defined as a new GM and coach? Fun fact: I want to the same high school he did! |
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Post by Dogecoin on Nov 8, 2019 12:42:27 GMT -5
raiders/gruden started w/ a young QB to build around.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 8, 2019 12:43:00 GMT -5
Fun fact: I want to the same high school he did! I went to Southern High School in Louisville KY. Anyone get the reference? |
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Post by Delicreep on Nov 8, 2019 12:49:20 GMT -5
Fun fact: I want to the same high school he did! I went to Southern High School in Louisville KY. Anyone get the reference? Do you know what the difference is between a zoo in NY and a zoo in KY? They both have descriptions of the animals, but the zoo's in KY also have recipes. And no on the reference |
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Post by TheAnalyst on Nov 8, 2019 12:49:24 GMT -5
What are your thoughts on this? Both teams got new HCs (Shurmur/Gruden), new GMs (Gettleman/Mayock), traded away great talent (OBJ/Cooper and Vernon/Mack).... Yet the Raiders are the ones showing improvement while the NY Giants are not. This is what is disappointing to me. They moved to 5-4 last night. Look respectable. We are 2-7 and look terrible. So why do you guys think the Raiders rebuild is working much better/quicker than the Giants rebuild as of now? The raiders did not dismantle their entire team . Still on the Raiders from 2017 25% retention Reggie Nelson Karl Joseph Nicholas Morrow Dexter McDonald Justin Ellis Marquel Lee DeAndre Washington Jalen Richard Keith McGill Rodney Hudson Derrick Carr Maurice Hurst Gabe Jackson Still on the Giants from 2017 17 % retention Eli Jack rabbit Wayne Gallman Rhett Ellison Zak DeOssie Jon Halapio Dalvin Tomlinson Sterling Shepard Evan Engram The Raiders had 72 million in cap space this past off season. The Giants had 23 million The Giants are starting a rookie QB. Fair enough, but the Raiders are still a very young team as well. I just heard that their last 6 TDs were from rookies. They are still learning too. How much of the cap space was used by the Raiders the past 2 off seasons by how much the Giants used the past 2 off seasons? Just to compare. we know our big splurge should be in 2020. Also, We started with the seasoned vet Eli, and looked atrocious anyways. Not sure the rookie QB has much to do with it. Most here thought Derrick Carr was about out in LA anyways after last year. He appears to have been coached up. To me I think the 2 biggest factors of why our rebuild isnt taking off and improving quite like the Raiders rebuild has done, is due to the failed rebuild of the OL and the coaching selections thus far. |
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Post by TEM on Nov 8, 2019 12:52:22 GMT -5
The raiders did not dismantle their entire team . Still on the Raiders from 2017 25% retention Reggie Nelson Karl Joseph Nicholas Morrow Dexter McDonald Justin Ellis Marquel Lee DeAndre Washington Jalen Richard Keith McGill Rodney Hudson Derrick Carr Maurice Hurst Gabe Jackson Still on the Giants from 2017 17 % retention Eli Jack rabbit Wayne Gallman Rhett Ellison Zak DeOssie Jon Halapio Dalvin Tomlinson Sterling Shepard Evan Engram The Raiders had 72 million in cap space this past off season. The Giants had 23 million The Giants are starting a rookie QB. Fair enough, but the Raiders are still a very young team as well. I just heard that their last 6 TDs were from rookies. They are still learning too. How much of the cap space was used by the Raiders the past 2 off seasons by how much the Giants used the past 2 off seasons? Just to compare. we know our big splurge should be in 2020. Also, We started with the seasoned vet Eli, and looked atrocious anyways. Not sure the rookie QB has much to do with it. Most here thought Derrick Carr was about out in LA anyways after last year. He appears to have been coached up. To me I think the 2 biggest factors of why our rebuild isnt taking off and improving quite like the Raiders rebuild has done, is due to the failed rebuild of the OL and the coaching selections thus far. you cannot compare what Eli would have done to the rookie. He averages 2 turnovers a game . It is hard to win like that. I am cool with it. I can see the light at the end of the tunnel . We are in learning mode. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 8, 2019 12:53:16 GMT -5
I went to Southern High School in Louisville KY. Anyone get the reference? Do you know what the difference is between a zoo in NY and a zoo in KY? They both have descriptions of the animals, but the zoo's in KY also have recipes. And no on the reference lol..... Phil Simms also went to that HS He was about 10 years ahead of me though. |
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Post by TheAnalyst on Nov 8, 2019 12:55:23 GMT -5
Fair enough, but the Raiders are still a very young team as well. I just heard that their last 6 TDs were from rookies. They are still learning too. How much of the cap space was used by the Raiders the past 2 off seasons by how much the Giants used the past 2 off seasons? Just to compare. we know our big splurge should be in 2020. Also, We started with the seasoned vet Eli, and looked atrocious anyways. Not sure the rookie QB has much to do with it. Most here thought Derrick Carr was about out in LA anyways after last year. He appears to have been coached up. To me I think the 2 biggest factors of why our rebuild isnt taking off and improving quite like the Raiders rebuild has done, is due to the failed rebuild of the OL and the coaching selections thus far. you cannot compare what Eli would have done to the rookie. He averages 2 a game . It is hard to win like that. I am cool with it. I cam see the light at the end of the tunnel Why not? I think we all have seen Eli enough to know how he would do behind center this season. And we 100% weren't winning that Bucs game with Eli. Thats 50% of our wins. |
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Post by Delicreep on Nov 8, 2019 12:57:16 GMT -5
Do you know what the difference is between a zoo in NY and a zoo in KY? They both have descriptions of the animals, but the zoo's in KY also have recipes. And no on the reference lol..... Phil Simms also went to that HS He was about 10 years ahead of me though. very cool |
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