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Post by Morehead State on Sept 5, 2018 12:27:17 GMT -5
I’m going to go way out on a limb and trust Pat Shurmur with this one. People are so quick to forget that Shurmur made it very clear early on that there was no depth chart behind Eli. Now everyone just assumes it was Webb’s job to backup Eli. Here’s the reality. It was only Webb’s job in your mind. Everyone ripped the team last year for not giving Webb a chance when the season became a lost cause. This new regime gave him every opportunity to win the #2 job, and he didn’t. Time to move on. Did they? It seems now that there was nothing he could do to keep from being either traded or released. It seems to me that the day Dave Gettleman was hired was the day that Davis Webb's fate was sealed.
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Post by GameTime on Sept 5, 2018 12:32:01 GMT -5
Everyone ripped the team last year for not giving Webb a chance when the season became a lost cause. This new regime gave him every opportunity to win the #2 job, and he didn’t. Time to move on. Did they? It seems now that there was nothing he could do to keep from being either traded or released. It seems to me that the day Dave Gettleman was hired was the day that Davis Webb's fate was sealed.
I now agree with that premise. Webb would have had looked the next Brady in order to have been retained. |
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Post by nyg9289 on Sept 5, 2018 12:37:55 GMT -5
Everyone ripped the team last year for not giving Webb a chance when the season became a lost cause. This new regime gave him every opportunity to win the #2 job, and he didn’t. Time to move on. Did they? It seems now that there was nothing he could do to keep from being either traded or released. It seems to me that the day Dave Gettleman was hired was the day that Davis Webb's fate was sealed.
Exactly. Easy concept that some people can't understand. |
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Post by Morehead State on Sept 5, 2018 12:39:00 GMT -5
Did they? It seems now that there was nothing he could do to keep from being either traded or released. It seems to me that the day Dave Gettleman was hired was the day that Davis Webb's fate was sealed.
I now agree with that premise. Webb would have had looked the next Brady in order to have been retained. It would seem so. If they thought he was no good why would they try to trade him? They would just cut him. They just didn't want him on the team.
I've said it several times but they acted like they never heard of him when they were hired. Then the "He follows Eli around like a puppy" comment showed just how little they considered him.
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Post by nyg9289 on Sept 5, 2018 12:39:12 GMT -5
They like Lauletta better than Webb.What don't you understand? Webb at least has the frame to absorb a hit or two and could throw the ball more than 20 yards down the field Lauletta doesn't have an NFL arm and I don't care what they say about his accuracy....sometimes you need to throw something else besides 5 yard outs in the flats Couldn't agree more. |
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Post by nyg9289 on Sept 5, 2018 12:47:21 GMT -5
We have a skinny little QB from Richmond who lacks arm strength and has never seen true game action....and Alex Tanney. While Lauletta has potential, he is absolutely nowhere near ready to play in the NFL if Eli goes down in week 1. This alone should've been reason enough to keep Webb. Amazing how so many other teams have serviceable/solid QBs as backups and yet all we have is a rookie with clear development needs. The season is literally over if Eli goes down. I was/am a fan of Webb but he had almost zero real game experience too. Also how many teams in the NFL have viable B/Us?....3 or 4 maybe. The back up QB is very rarely a position that means much. Unless its a developing kid with big promise. Well the Jets now have a guy on their practice squad who is better than both of our backups. As for other teams, the Saints, Ravens, Colts, Pats, Eagles, Bucs, and Browns come immediately to mind. And then I'm sure there are a bunch of other teams with better backups as well. And I totally disagree with you. The backup position is incredibly important. QBs get injured all the time (Luck, Peyton Manning, Brady, Wentz, Romo, Flacco, Aikman, Palmer, the list goes on and on). |
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Post by Delicreep on Sept 5, 2018 12:47:24 GMT -5
I now agree with that premise. Webb would have had looked the next Brady in order to have been retained. It would seem so. If they thought he was no good why would they try to trade him? They would just cut him. They just didn't want him on the team.
I've said it several times but they acted like they never heard of him when they were hired. Then the "He follows Eli around like a puppy" comment showed just how little they considered him.
Are you suggesting that Webb looked significantly better than Lauletta in the preseason? |
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Post by GameTime on Sept 5, 2018 12:53:48 GMT -5
I was/am a fan of Webb but he had almost zero real game experience too. Also how many teams in the NFL have viable B/Us?....3 or 4 maybe. The back up QB is very rarely a position that means much. Unless its a developing kid with big promise. Well the Jets now have a guy on their practice squad who is better than both of our backups. As for other teams, the Saints, Ravens, Colts, Pats, Eagles, Bucs, and Browns come immediately to mind. And then I'm sure there are a bunch of other teams with better backups as well. And I totally disagree with you. The backup position is incredibly important. QBs get injured all the time (Luck, Peyton Manning, Brady, Wentz, Romo, Flacco, Aikman, Palmer, the list goes on and on). and which of thos teams had success with their back ups. Foles and he's and outlier and a lucky season |
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Post by boxcarwillie on Sept 5, 2018 12:55:40 GMT -5
Question: would a coach ever pass over the #2 QB and insert #3 into garbage time, to get him some development?
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Speedman
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Post by Speedman on Sept 5, 2018 13:00:09 GMT -5
They like Lauletta better than Webb.What don't you understand? Webb at least has the frame to absorb a hit or two and could throw the ball more than 20 yards down the field Lauletta doesn't have an NFL arm and I don't care what they say about his accuracy....sometimes you need to throw something else besides 5 yard outs in the flats It seems to me that the DB’s are too fast for Lauletta’s arm. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 5, 2018 13:00:45 GMT -5
Question: would a coach ever pass over the #2 QB and insert #3 into garbage time, to get him some development? Lauletta will likely be an inactive # 3 most games. If the season is lost I think he'd assume the # 2 duties later in the year. No way we are activating 3 QBs on game days. |
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Post by Roswell on Sept 5, 2018 13:03:10 GMT -5
We have a skinny little QB from Richmond who lacks arm strength and has never seen true game action....and Alex Tanney. While Lauletta has potential, he is absolutely nowhere near ready to play in the NFL if Eli goes down in week 1. This alone should've been reason enough to keep Webb. Amazing how so many other teams have serviceable/solid QBs as backups and yet all we have is a rookie with clear development needs. The season is literally over if Eli goes down. Having Webb here would have changed none of this. Agreed. |
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Post by Morehead State on Sept 5, 2018 13:11:47 GMT -5
Having Webb here would have changed none of this. Agreed. If everyone seems to agree that the "season would be over" if Eli goes down......and I'm sure you're all right, then this FO has failed miserably. If you are a "win now" team, you need a back up who can keep the team afloat. The Packers failed miserably last year as did the Cards etc.....
The Eagles understood the importance of a winning team having a competent back up.
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Post by nyg9289 on Sept 5, 2018 13:27:51 GMT -5
Well the Jets now have a guy on their practice squad who is better than both of our backups. As for other teams, the Saints, Ravens, Colts, Pats, Eagles, Bucs, and Browns come immediately to mind. And then I'm sure there are a bunch of other teams with better backups as well. And I totally disagree with you. The backup position is incredibly important. QBs get injured all the time (Luck, Peyton Manning, Brady, Wentz, Romo, Flacco, Aikman, Palmer, the list goes on and on). and which of thos teams had success with their back ups. Foles and he's and outlier and a lucky season Cowboys w/ Dak. Pats w/ Cassell went 11-5. Foles with the Eagles. Not sure about the others. |
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Post by Delicreep on Sept 5, 2018 13:28:56 GMT -5
If everyone seems to agree that the "season would be over" if Eli goes down......and I'm sure you're all right, then this FO has failed miserably. If you are a "win now" team, you need a back up who can keep the team afloat. The Packers failed miserably last year as did the Cards etc.....
The Eagles understood the importance of a winning team having a competent back up.
You cannot seriously believe that we are actually a "win now" team, despite what we have heard from the FO. We won 3 games last year! |
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Post by Morehead State on Sept 5, 2018 13:33:16 GMT -5
If everyone seems to agree that the "season would be over" if Eli goes down......and I'm sure you're all right, then this FO has failed miserably. If you are a "win now" team, you need a back up who can keep the team afloat. The Packers failed miserably last year as did the Cards etc.....
The Eagles understood the importance of a winning team having a competent back up.
You cannot seriously believe that we are actually a "win now" team, despite what we have heard from the FO. We won 3 games last year! I don't actually. I guess that makes me a hater. |
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Post by GameTime on Sept 5, 2018 13:37:20 GMT -5
and which of thos teams had success with their back ups. Foles and he's and outlier and a lucky season Cowboys w/ Dak. Pats w/ Cassell went 11-5. Foles with the Eagles. Not sure about the others. ok...you've made some points but all in all back up QBs after thoguhts. If you'd be lucky to have a serviceable one .. And I liked Webb and I believe he would have been a more polished back up but I didnt see him day in and day out either. |
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Post by GameTime on Sept 5, 2018 13:38:05 GMT -5
If everyone seems to agree that the "season would be over" if Eli goes down......and I'm sure you're all right, then this FO has failed miserably. If you are a "win now" team, you need a back up who can keep the team afloat. The Packers failed miserably last year as did the Cards etc.....
The Eagles understood the importance of a winning team having a competent back up.
in their wildest dreams they did not see Foles getting it done like he did |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 5, 2018 13:40:32 GMT -5
If everyone seems to agree that the "season would be over" if Eli goes down......and I'm sure you're all right, then this FO has failed miserably. If you are a "win now" team, you need a back up who can keep the team afloat. The Packers failed miserably last year as did the Cards etc.....
The Eagles understood the importance of a winning team having a competent back up.
You cannot seriously believe that we are actually a "win now" team, despite what we have heard from the FO. We won 3 games last year! Of course, nobody who knows anything about football actually believes it...but, we were told that. |
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Post by TCHOF on Sept 5, 2018 13:46:46 GMT -5
Everyone ripped the team last year for not giving Webb a chance when the season became a lost cause. This new regime gave him every opportunity to win the #2 job, and he didn’t. Time to move on. Did they? It seems now that there was nothing he could do to keep from being either traded or released. It seems to me that the day Dave Gettleman was hired was the day that Davis Webb's fate was sealed.
So they just gave him all of those second team reps just to cover up their true intentions? |
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Post by Morehead State on Sept 5, 2018 13:48:48 GMT -5
If everyone seems to agree that the "season would be over" if Eli goes down......and I'm sure you're all right, then this FO has failed miserably. If you are a "win now" team, you need a back up who can keep the team afloat. The Packers failed miserably last year as did the Cards etc.....
The Eagles understood the importance of a winning team having a competent back up.
in their wildest dreams they did not see Foles getting it done like he did In their wildest dreams? Yes. Did they assume he would win a SB? Of course not.
Generally if a starting QB gets hurt, a good back up (which is all Foles is) should be able to keep the ship afloat. These are generally guys who have started in the league and have won games. Mark Sanchez was that guy for the Eagles a few years ago. he had won with the Jets and won some games with Philly when Vick went down, including torching us.
But that's generally when the starter isn't out for the season. If Hundley had just won half his games, then GB would have still been in it when Rodgers got back. But he was horrible.
If Eli goes down and they actually think we can be a winning team, we need a guy who can keep the ship afloat.....until he comes back in theory. Why do you think the Saints traded for Bridgewater? They are a win now team. Maybe the best team in football. If Brees goes down they know they need a guy to keep it going. Smart move actually because he could very well be the guy after Brees retires.
The fact that Alex Tanney or Kyle Lauletta (or even Davis Webb for that matter) are our back ups suggest that they are either not think we are a winning team, or are being foolish with our team.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 5, 2018 13:52:14 GMT -5
in their wildest dreams they did not see Foles getting it done like he did In their wildest dreams? Yes. Did they assume he would win a SB? Of course not.
Generally if a starting QB gets hurt, a good back up (which is all Foles is) should be able to keep the ship afloat. These are generally guys who have started in the league and have won games. Mark Sanchez was that guy for the Eagles a few years ago. he had won with the Jets and won some games with Philly when Vick went down, including torching us.
But that's generally when the starter isn't out for the season. If Hundley had just won half his games, then GB would have still been in it when Rodgers got back. But he was horrible.
If Eli goes down and they actually think we can be a winning team, we need a guy who can keep the ship afloat.....until he comes back in theory. Why do you think the Saints traded for Bridgewater? They are a win now team. Maybe the best team in football. If Brees goes down they know they need a guy to keep it going. Smart move actually because he could very well be the guy after Brees retires.
The fact that Alex Tanney or Kyle Lauletta (or even Davis Webb for that matter) are our back ups suggest that they are either not think we are a winning team, or are being foolish with our team.
Based on Gettleman’s rhetoric it can’t be the former, so...must be the latter. |
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Post by Morehead State on Sept 5, 2018 13:52:40 GMT -5
Did they? It seems now that there was nothing he could do to keep from being either traded or released. It seems to me that the day Dave Gettleman was hired was the day that Davis Webb's fate was sealed.
So they just gave him all of those second team reps just to cover up their true intentions? Stop it. You know how these things go. If Lauletta was dreadful or if Webb played like a star, things would have changed. But it seems the chance being given to Webb to make the team was token at best. Or maybe create a chance to make a trade, which I understand they were close to making with Oakland.
I doubt there were sinister intentions. I just think they weren't interested in Webb very much at all.
But who can argue that Alex Tanney is any kind of option at all? That is a head scratcher.
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Post by Morehead State on Sept 5, 2018 13:53:25 GMT -5
In their wildest dreams? Yes. Did they assume he would win a SB? Of course not.
Generally if a starting QB gets hurt, a good back up (which is all Foles is) should be able to keep the ship afloat. These are generally guys who have started in the league and have won games. Mark Sanchez was that guy for the Eagles a few years ago. he had won with the Jets and won some games with Philly when Vick went down, including torching us.
But that's generally when the starter isn't out for the season. If Hundley had just won half his games, then GB would have still been in it when Rodgers got back. But he was horrible.
If Eli goes down and they actually think we can be a winning team, we need a guy who can keep the ship afloat.....until he comes back in theory. Why do you think the Saints traded for Bridgewater? They are a win now team. Maybe the best team in football. If Brees goes down they know they need a guy to keep it going. Smart move actually because he could very well be the guy after Brees retires.
The fact that Alex Tanney or Kyle Lauletta (or even Davis Webb for that matter) are our back ups suggest that they are either not think we are a winning team, or are being foolish with our team.
Based on Gettleman’s rhetoric it can’t be the former, so...must be the latter. <iframe style="position: absolute; width: 22.579999999999927px; height: 11.700000000000045px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none;left: 15px; top: -5px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_98295696" scrolling="no" width="22.579999999999927" height="11.700000000000045"></iframe> <iframe style="position: absolute; width: 22.58px; height: 11.7px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none; left: 1070px; top: -5px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_23233366" scrolling="no" width="22.579999999999927" height="11.700000000000045"></iframe> <iframe style="position: absolute; width: 22.58px; height: 11.7px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none; left: 15px; top: 519px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_10353247" scrolling="no" width="22.579999999999927" height="11.700000000000045"></iframe> <iframe style="position: absolute; width: 22.58px; height: 11.7px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none; left: 1070px; top: 519px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_63406396" scrolling="no" width="22.579999999999927" height="11.700000000000045"></iframe> That is my opinion at least. |
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Post by Parademon1 on Sept 5, 2018 13:54:14 GMT -5
Everyone says "we won 3 games last yr" like we did it with a fully healthy roster with OBJ/Brandon Marshall/Shep healthy all yr. 2 of those guys went down for the yr in the same damn game in week 5, Shep only played 11 games due to missing 5 with injuries. So our 3 top WRs missed a total of 27 games due to injury, we had no run game, our OL sucked, our D was dysfunctional & quitting in games, 3 got suspended cuz coach menu lost the locker room probably when we lost OBJ to go to 0-5 & you all keep harping that we only won 3 games. Let's see how great Matty ice is & how many games he wins if he loses Julio Jones & whomever is his #2 WR for the yr. A healthy OBJ/Mashall/Shep all last yr & we win at minimum, 7-8 games. Remember, Eli gave our D 3 late 4th qt leads vs Philly/TB/LA & the D blew the leads. In the 2nd game vs Philly, w/o OBJ, Eli lit em up for over 400yds & 3 TDs. A healthy OBJ in that game & we beat em.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 5, 2018 13:59:47 GMT -5
Too much forward looking going on.
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Post by Morehead State on Sept 5, 2018 14:00:39 GMT -5
Everyone says "we won 3 games last yr" like we did it with a fully healthy roster with OBJ/Brandon Marshall/Shep healthy all yr. 2 of those guys went down for the yr in the same damn game in week 5, Shep only played 11 games due to missing 5 with injuries. So our 3 top WRs missed a total of 27 games due to injury, we had no run game, our OL sucked, our D was dysfunctional & quitting in games, 3 got suspended cuz coach menu lost the locker room probably when we lost OBJ to go to 0-5 & you all keep harping that we only won 3 games. Let's see how great Matty ice is & how many games he wins if he loses Julio Jones & whomever is his #2 WR for the yr. A healthy OBJ/Mashall/Shep all last yr & we win at minimum, 7-8 games. Remember, Eli gave our D 3 late 4th qt leads vs Philly/TB/LA & they D blew the leads. In the 2nd game vs Philly, w/o OBJ, Eli lit em up for over 400yds & 3 TDs. A healthy OBJ in that game & we beat em. Then why were the HC and GM fired? Why do we have completely new offensive and defensive schemes and a completely new coaching staff? Why are so many of the old players now gone off this team?
If it was just injuries.....then why make so many changes?
May I remind you of our record before Odell, Shepard and Marshall went down? It was 0-5. May I also remind you that Philly lost their all pro left tackle before the season started. they lost their #1 CB for the first half of the season. They lost their 3rd down back early. They lost their MVP candidate QB after week 13.
In other words....team's have injuries. Usually a lot of them. The NFL is a game of attrition. The worst injury a team can have is at the QB position. Ours was healthy all year and led us to a 3-13 record.
In other words, the season was already over when these devastating injuries happened.
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Post by Roosevelt on Sept 5, 2018 14:05:30 GMT -5
I’m going to go way out on a limb and trust Pat Shurmur with this one. People are so quick to forget that Shurmur made it very clear early on that there was no depth chart behind Eli. Now everyone just assumes it was Webb’s job to backup Eli. Here’s the reality. It was only Webb’s job in your mind. The only real complaint is there is no upside with Tanney - who has been named the backup for Jacksonville. If things go how they tend to go in the league then Tanney will hold down the backup spot and Lauletta will hardly even dress and be relegated to scout team. I hope he cracks in as the #2 ASAP but in my mind they shouldn’t even wait. Gettleman should take this one out if he coaches hands and just cut Tanney and tell the coach to get Lauletta prepping for games. We don’t need Tanney taking any snaps for the Giants this year. Except that Shurmur has already stated that he likes a veteran back-up on the roster.
I don't know, while I never watch the 4th string guys that closely; Tanney did catch my eye. He was definitely better than I expected.
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Post by Roosevelt on Sept 5, 2018 14:08:26 GMT -5
Everyone ripped the team last year for not giving Webb a chance when the season became a lost cause. This new regime gave him every opportunity to win the #2 job, and he didn’t. Time to move on. Did they? It seems now that there was nothing he could do to keep from being either traded or released. It seems to me that the day Dave Gettleman was hired was the day that Davis Webb's fate was sealed.
I liked that he was given the opportunity to bounce back from the Browns, by playing with the ones against the Lions.
I also think that by drafting Lauletta, that was clearly a sign right there that they weren't sold on Davis.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 5, 2018 14:09:47 GMT -5
Last year was bad, but fixing it to serviceable did not take a genius. The problem is serviceable is the worst thing a team can be. Did this regime do enough to take us from bad to good? I don't think so mainly because I don't trust Eli or the depth.
The improvements:
1) Beckham healthy - This is not Gettleman or Shurmur being a genius
2) Actually paid the Oline attention, threw cash at Solder, spent Round 2 on Hernandez, however I'm not sold on our overall line being much better. I think LT is better. I think LG-C-RG-RT may be the same or worse overall.
3) Barkley is better than Darkwa although I wish Darkwa was still here over Stewart
On D I don't think our overall personnel is better. I think any improvement would come from the offense have better ball control along with effort coached up by Bettcher and not having the season dead.
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