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Post by Deleted on Sept 6, 2018 15:42:37 GMT -5
My problem with the Barkley selection was a few things:
1) RBs are cheap assets, you can get proven ones in FA for peanuts compared to premium positions
2) RBs are consistently found outside of Round 1 ie David Johnson, Leveon Bell, Kamara, Freeman, Murray, Howard etc
3) RBs are undersized players in comparison to the Dlineman and it's their job to run towards these Dline, it leads to them being consistently banged up and the elite portion of their careers is by and large very short
4) They are blocking reliant. For the most part show me a good Oline and I'll show you a RB people think is good behind it
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Post by Fletch842 on Sept 6, 2018 15:46:44 GMT -5
One point to add, just to stir the pot (I'm like that sometimes...). There is a thread on the Giants home page with some quotes. This is from Shula:
Q: What was your preseason evaluation of (Kyle Lauletta), because obviously the organization went with him over (Davis Webb) as the young quarterback?
A: We think Kyle is a young guy that just has continued to get better with reps. He’s got very good football intelligence, I think he’s got some intangibles that you need at that position. For a young guy, and not just out there on the field, we’ve got him reps. Ideally, we try to get all the guys more reps, but you can kind of sense that day in and day out, the learning process that he’s going through and how quickly he’s picking things up – not just by what you see on the field, but how he is in the meeting rooms with the other players, always kind of thinking about things other than maybe just the way it’s drawn up. I think his arrow is definitely pointing up, and looking forward to working with him more.
reading between the lines, perhaps the staff just felt that Webb was just not picking up the nuances of the offense quickly enough.
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Post by DJones19 on Sept 6, 2018 15:52:41 GMT -5
We had Geno and Davis last season, and Nassib before...so if Eli went down the season would be shot anyway Geno looked just about every bit as good as Eli in his 1 start last year. He played so well this preseason he's earned a backup spot instead of a camp body which many expected. Maybe I'm in the minority but I see Eli as a big concern going forward. If he doesn't produce at a high level this year with all the weapons around him I think he should retire. I'm tired of mediocrity (at best) out of our 100 million dollar quarterback.
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Sept 6, 2018 16:15:00 GMT -5
One point to add, just to stir the pot (I'm like that sometimes...). There is a thread on the Giants home page with some quotes. This is from Shula: Q: What was your preseason evaluation of (Kyle Lauletta), because obviously the organization went with him over (Davis Webb) as the young quarterback? A: We think Kyle is a young guy that just has continued to get better with reps. He’s got very good football intelligence, I think he’s got some intangibles that you need at that position. For a young guy, and not just out there on the field, we’ve got him reps. Ideally, we try to get all the guys more reps, but you can kind of sense that day in and day out, the learning process that he’s going through and how quickly he’s picking things up – not just by what you see on the field, but how he is in the meeting rooms with the other players, always kind of thinking about things other than maybe just the way it’s drawn up. I think his arrow is definitely pointing up, and looking forward to working with him more. reading between the lines, perhaps the staff just felt that Webb was just not picking up the nuances of the offense quickly enough. Fletch think your on the money here ,this was coaches decision I read right after the draft forgot where a couple times with the authors saying his timing and anticipation would separate him from Webb who I liked
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Sept 6, 2018 16:19:10 GMT -5
We had Geno and Davis last season, and Nassib before...so if Eli went down the season would be shot anyway Geno looked just about every bit as good as Eli in his 1 start last year. He played so well this preseason he's earned a backup spot instead of a camp body which many expected. Maybe I'm in the minority but I see Eli as a big concern going forward. If he doesn't produce at a high level this year with all the weapons around him I think he should retire. I'm tired of mediocrity (at best) out of our 100 million dollar quarterback. He looked great 2 fumbles and was there an INT,Eli already has proven with time and a run game he will be fine or at least more then good enough to win with.
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Post by EliQB10 on Sept 6, 2018 17:10:24 GMT -5
We had Geno and Davis last season, and Nassib before...so if Eli went down the season would be shot anyway Geno looked just about every bit as good as Eli in his 1 start last year. He played so well this preseason he's earned a backup spot instead of a camp body which many expected. Maybe I'm in the minority but I see Eli as a big concern going forward. If he doesn't produce at a high level this year with all the weapons around him I think he should retire. I'm tired of mediocrity (at best) out of our 100 million dollar quarterback. Geno played OK same result was turnovers and a loss. I don't know if there is actually a minority when it comes to Eli but you are not alone that's for sure...If the offense does not produce on a high level because of Eli then maybe Eli is done? Regarding mediocrity I don't think any true blue Giants fan is not tired of the mediocrity but the current condition this team is in took a while to get this way and will not be fixed overnight...
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Sept 6, 2018 17:47:31 GMT -5
Geno looked just about every bit as good as Eli in his 1 start last year. He played so well this preseason he's earned a backup spot instead of a camp body which many expected. Maybe I'm in the minority but I see Eli as a big concern going forward. If he doesn't produce at a high level this year with all the weapons around him I think he should retire. I'm tired of mediocrity (at best) out of our 100 million dollar quarterback. Geno played OK same result was turnovers and a loss. I don't know if there is actually a minority when it comes to Eli but you are not alone that's for sure...If the offense does not produce on a high level because of Eli then maybe Eli is done? Regarding mediocrity I don't think any true blue Giants fan is not tired of the mediocrity but the current condition this team is in took a while to get this way and will not be fixed overnight... I am not an Eli homer but I'm not gonna dog him ,the guy has not had a real chance the last 5-6 years, it is not his fault his organization let him down that is one thing no one can dispute and be honest with there selves,things were not trending in a positive direction if they didn't buy a defensive line they would have been dysfunctional on both sides of the ball,thenwe might of had the first overall pick in the draft.
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Post by EliQB10 on Sept 6, 2018 18:03:55 GMT -5
Geno played OK same result was turnovers and a loss. I don't know if there is actually a minority when it comes to Eli but you are not alone that's for sure...If the offense does not produce on a high level because of Eli then maybe Eli is done? Regarding mediocrity I don't think any true blue Giants fan is not tired of the mediocrity but the current condition this team is in took a while to get this way and will not be fixed overnight... I am not an Eli homer but I'm not gonna dog him ,the guy has not had a real chance the last 5-6 years, it is not his fault his organization let him down that is one thing no one can dispute and be honest with there selves,things were not trending in a positive direction if they didn't buy a defensive line they would have been dysfunctional on both sides of the ball,thenwe might of had the first overall pick in the draft. I agree and have said more or less what you have said here in numerous posts. Some just don't get it and want to put all the blame on Eli. I'm hoping that the new regime can get it all together while Eli is still here for one more run with him in the playoffs...
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Sept 6, 2018 18:22:19 GMT -5
I am not an Eli homer but I'm not gonna dog him ,the guy has not had a real chance the last 5-6 years, it is not his fault his organization let him down that is one thing no one can dispute and be honest with there selves,things were not trending in a positive direction if they didn't buy a defensive line they would have been dysfunctional on both sides of the ball,thenwe might of had the first overall pick in the draft. I agree and have said more or less what you have said here in numerous posts. Some just don't get it and want to put all the blame on Eli. I'm hoping that the new regime can get it all together while Eli is still here for one more run with him in the playoffs... It would be a nice end to his career I like to see classy guys get to go out with a win, thats why I was sad for Webb great kid ton of class unfortunately he ended up on the same team as a guy just like him with a little more in the intangibles department.
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Post by Jomo on Sept 6, 2018 18:30:54 GMT -5
It is totally true that if Eli goes down we are relying on Alex ****ing Tanney to win a game for us.
Yes we are screwed but no more screwed than we were when Ryan F. Nassib was our backup QB.
I suspect they would go out and pay through the nose for a veteran if Eli were out for an extended period of time.
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Post by Parademon1 on Sept 6, 2018 18:34:13 GMT -5
Look, I'm one of the biggest Eli supporters on this board & I will be the 1st one here to want him benched if with the best talent at the WR/RB/TE positions in his 14yr career, he stinks it up. But I really don't see that happening due to whom the HC is compared to what was here the past 2 yrs & the fact that for the 1st time in 4yrs, he doesn't have to worry about his 6 like he did with the human turnstile "guarding" his back. You give Eli time to go thru his reads/progressions & he will tear up any NFL D in the league. Give him 2 - 2.5 secs & you'll get what we've seen the past 2 yrs, a quick dump off to the RB, a bullet to the ground or if we're lucky a quick slant play to the WR. How Eli performs is all prevalent on the play of the OL, not on him. No NFL QB can function effectively with under 3 secs of pass pro, don't care if it's AR or Brady.
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Post by EliQB10 on Sept 6, 2018 18:35:15 GMT -5
It is totally true that if Eli goes down we are relying on Alex ****ing Tanney to win a game for us. Yes we are screwed but no more screwed than we were when Ryan F. Nassib was our backup QB. I suspect they would go out and pay through the nose for a veteran if Eli were out for an extended period of time. Exactly...
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Post by EliQB10 on Sept 6, 2018 18:38:15 GMT -5
I agree and have said more or less what you have said here in numerous posts. Some just don't get it and want to put all the blame on Eli. I'm hoping that the new regime can get it all together while Eli is still here for one more run with him in the playoffs... It would be a nice end to his career I like to see classy guys get to go out with a win, thats why I was sad for Webb great kid ton of class unfortunately he ended up on the same team as a guy just like him with a little more in the intangibles department. Both Eli and Webb are class acts. We already know what Eli can do...hopefully Webb will get a chance someday...
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Sept 6, 2018 18:44:45 GMT -5
Look, I'm one of the biggest Eli supporters on this board & I will be the 1st one here to want him benched if with the best talent at the WR/RB/TE positions in his 14yr career, he stinks it up. But I really don't see that happening due to whom the HC is compared to what was here the past 2 yrs & the fact that for the 1st time in 4yrs, he doesn't have to worry about his 6 like he did with the human turnstile "guarding" his back. You give Eli time to go thru his reads/progressions & he will tear up any NFL D in the league. Give him 2 - 2.5 secs & you'll get what we've seen the past 2 yrs, a quick dump off to the RB, a bullet to the ground or if we're lucky a quick slant play to the WR. How Eli performs is all prevalent on the play of the OL, not on him. No NFL QB can function effectively with under 3 secs of pass pro, don't care if it's AR or Brady. still a little worried about the OL against top tier talent like the Jags hope they hold there own I will feel 100% better if they can do that against this front.
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Post by Fletch842 on Sept 6, 2018 19:15:01 GMT -5
It is totally true that if Eli goes down we are relying on Alex ****ing Tanney to win a game for us. Yes we are screwed but no more screwed than we were when Ryan F. Nassib was our backup QB. I suspect they would go out and pay through the nose for a veteran if Eli were out for an extended period of time. at least Tanney looked pretty good against the ultra scrubs, not that you can read too much into it but his throws were accurate and crisp. Whether he can do that against legitimate NFL defenses is unknown, hopefully we don't find out...
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Post by Morehead State on Sept 6, 2018 19:30:31 GMT -5
It is totally true that if Eli goes down we are relying on Alex ****ing Tanney to win a game for us. Yes we are screwed but no more screwed than we were when Ryan F. Nassib was our backup QB. I suspect they would go out and pay through the nose for a veteran if Eli were out for an extended period of time. at least Tanney looked pretty good against the ultra scrubs, not that you can read too much into it but his throws were accurate and crisp. Whether he can do that against legitimate NFL defenses is unknown, hopefully we don't find out... Tanney is useless. If Eli goes down, it will be Lauletta eventually. Probably after no more than a game.
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Post by Fletch842 on Sept 6, 2018 19:34:55 GMT -5
at least Tanney looked pretty good against the ultra scrubs, not that you can read too much into it but his throws were accurate and crisp. Whether he can do that against legitimate NFL defenses is unknown, hopefully we don't find out... Tanney is useless. If Eli goes down, it will be Lauletta eventually. Probably after no more than a game. as the season progresses, I would expect a shift from Tanney to Lauletta at #2. Lauletta did show really nice pocket presence and footwork in his limited pre-season time, a pretty nice foundation to build off of (let me keep my rose colored glasses on, please please please)
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Post by Morehead State on Sept 6, 2018 23:09:58 GMT -5
....and keep on waiting ,your mouse seems to work! I figured as much.
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Post by TCHOF on Sept 7, 2018 5:08:03 GMT -5
at least Tanney looked pretty good against the ultra scrubs, not that you can read too much into it but his throws were accurate and crisp. Whether he can do that against legitimate NFL defenses is unknown, hopefully we don't find out... Tanney is useless. If Eli goes down, it will be Lauletta eventually. Probably after no more than a game. Man, a lot of unwarranted hate toward a young guy working hard to make a living.
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Post by Morehead State on Sept 7, 2018 7:01:32 GMT -5
Tanney is useless. If Eli goes down, it will be Lauletta eventually. Probably after no more than a game. Man, a lot of unwarranted hate toward a young guy working hard to make a living. I'm a bitter and lonely man.
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Post by Morehead State on Sept 7, 2018 7:09:33 GMT -5
Man, a lot of unwarranted hate toward a young guy working hard to make a living. You noticed that too? Sad. It's an inside gag between me and TCHOF..
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Post by TCHOF on Sept 7, 2018 7:18:24 GMT -5
Man, a lot of unwarranted hate toward a young guy working hard to make a living. I'm a bitter and lonely man. Haha. Touché
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Post by Jomo on Sept 7, 2018 10:22:14 GMT -5
at least Tanney looked pretty good against the ultra scrubs, not that you can read too much into it but his throws were accurate and crisp. Whether he can do that against legitimate NFL defenses is unknown, hopefully we don't find out... Tanney is useless. If Eli goes down, it will be Lauletta eventually. Probably after no more than a game. I saw good and decisive reads from Lauletta but on deep balls (even medium deep balls) I saw too many floaters and hangers. I don't know whether he is a better prospect than Webb, who I like however it is more than reasonable to say that Shurmur should know much better than us what a good QB prospect looks like.
I heard Tex Schram say earlier this year that the one thing you can't really coach up in an NFL QB is accuracy. Lauletta seems accurate and decisive on short to medium routes. Schram didn''t specifically address arm strength and how far you can move the needle with a young player.
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Post by Fletch842 on Sept 7, 2018 12:29:25 GMT -5
Tanney is useless. If Eli goes down, it will be Lauletta eventually. Probably after no more than a game. I saw good and decisive reads from Lauletta but on deep balls (even medium deep balls) I saw too many floaters and hangers. I don't know whether he is a better prospect than Webb, who I like however it is more than reasonable to say that Shurmur should know much better than us what a good QB prospect looks like.
I heard Tex Schram say earlier this year that the one thing you can't really coach up in an NFL QB is accuracy. Lauletta seems accurate and decisive on short to medium routes. Schram didn''t specifically address arm strength and how far you can move the needle with a young player.
the one thing that really stood out to me (as superior) watching Lauletta play is his footwork.
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coughlinscorner
Special Teams
Gooble Gobble We Accept Her One of Us
Posts: 854
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Post by coughlinscorner on Sept 7, 2018 13:24:58 GMT -5
Shurmur was on Golic and Wingo earlier this week. Wingo recalled asking Bill Polian who the one player at the combine that no one was talking about . Polian replied Kyle Lauletta. That is good enough for me to give Shurmur and Gettleman the benefit of the doubt about cutting Webb.
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Post by DonnieYen on Sept 8, 2018 18:27:51 GMT -5
Webb wasn't the answer in a situation like this Lauletta will do just fine. Butt newsflash here If most teams Franchise QB's went down with season ending surgery most teams would be screwed. To down grade the Giants because of there back up QB Is kind of ridiculous. goo.gl/images/6CxTa1you ever hear of a guy named Trent Dilfer? The Eagles QB Dilfer'ed it last year and the Eagles QB had way more experience then Webb you cant compare the two. also how common is it to have a franchise QB go down and the back up win it all what like Hostetler, Drew Bledsoe, and Fowles can you think of any others. personally the opening game Atlanta and Eagles on Thursday I thought both teams looked like crap it was a horrible game.
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Post by TCHOF on Sept 8, 2018 18:48:04 GMT -5
Shurmur was on Golic and Wingo earlier this week. Wingo recalled asking Bill Polian who the one player at the combine that no one was talking about . Polian replied Kyle Lauletta. That is good enough for me to give Shurmur and Gettleman the benefit of the doubt about cutting Webb. Love listening to Bill Polian
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