Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2021 11:26:00 GMT -5
Any team's running game is determined by it's ability to block up front. RB's themselves, tend to be less relevant. In SF, it really doesn't matter much who is in that backfield. The point is that talented RB's can be had later in the draft and unless you are Derrick Henry, you DON'T pay them with a huge contract. Why pick a RB with the 2nd pick in the draft, if he needs the same things ALL RB's need to succeed?
Nailed it. Remember when Denver was churning out 1000 yard RBs like it was nothing? Literally taking undrafted dudes off a naval ship and having them rush for 1000 yards that season. Then when those dudes were coveted and signed by other teams they ended up being trash and out of the league quickly. It was the OL talent and zone blocking scheme. Not the RBs. And speaking of Derrick Henry... out for the season.Will be back for playoffs..
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jerky
Special Teams
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Post by jerky on Dec 1, 2021 11:38:49 GMT -5
Thanks for the great conversation. I'm glad we could talk past each other, a key to any great debate. I'm glad we can have a conversation while living up to our usernames out here.. Well done on your part I must say.. Well I was not trying to be a jerk (even though my name has nothing to do with that), so I apologize if my posts came across like that.
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Post by ThatGuyRich on Dec 1, 2021 11:46:11 GMT -5
Couldn't disagree more with this. Booker's effectiveness is entirely overstated. He had one decent game...not his fault though. It's our terrible oline's fault. How is Freeman on there?? One decent game then he was hurt. Who watches Barkley yesterday and puts any middling runs at his feet? I guarantee the Giants run blocking improvement last year would have benefited Barkley just like Wayne Gallman. I'll tell you what I do know, none of these other guys would have done what Barkley did on his 32 yard run. Basically Bookers performances have been exactly like Barkley's save for the big play potential. And had it been Barkley instead of Gallman last year, I think it's wild to think he would have been less effective. Booker almost never gets negative yards. Barkley constantly gets caught in the backfield for negative yards. I'm not comparing the talent, but with our horrible ol, Booker is a better RB. Just MO. Yes there is validity in your argument. At least we get positive yds. Don't think there is much a chance of a big play or at least a larger gain. If Booker gains 2 yds and makes it 2nd and 8 or if Barkley loses 2 yds and it's 2nd and 12 were still in a passing situation on 2nd down. Does Booker make the 32 yd run. But is his steadier gain even minimal better than a loss. It is a decision to consider by our offensive brain trust.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2021 11:53:05 GMT -5
I'm glad we can have a conversation while living up to our usernames out here.. Well done on your part I must say.. Well I was not trying to be a jerk (even though my name has nothing to do with that), so I apologize if my posts came across like that. You really weren't?? Interesting.. I want to get back to football discussions with the other fans out here nothing personal.. GO GIANTS!!
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Post by ThatGuyRich on Dec 1, 2021 11:56:21 GMT -5
Keyshawn needs his head to be examined. The no brainer is the no brain in his head. why would anybody quote Keyshawn as a source of information... I agree why would anyone l be l listening to Keyshwan. But in this case Keyshawn is right. Attachments:
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2021 12:00:16 GMT -5
Will be back for playoffs.. Thought they IR'd him. Either way.... then Christian McCaffery. I remember some talking heads saying they are expecting him back for the playoffs.. Interesting if he can and maybe he won't need 6 games to shake of the rust like that Giants RB needs!!
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Post by Rangers13 on Dec 1, 2021 12:44:21 GMT -5
i don’t understand why he doesn’t hit the hole fast. Year one he was full speed and cutting hard regardless. Now, he tippie toes in anticipation of seeing a hole to drop the throttle . . . yet so often he never finds the hole and gets tackled. He’s literally like a home run hitter who strikes out often. Just run north/south and use your moves at the 2nd level. For the most part yes, but too many times there is no hole to hit fast. How many times is the defense filling gaps and there are more defenders than blockers. Nobody fears our passing game so the defense first read is the run thus loading the box. SB sometimes needs to cut before he even reaches the OL. I too would just plow ahead and get what I could get. I think thats pretty much what he is doing. I don't know if were trying more trap blocks to spring him or trying to bull foward and get to the 2nd level. I just don't know what to do. But what were doing it's not working. If were not doing what we did for Gallman last year please lets try that. you’re correct about the OL and holes yet we’ve all seen times where should be running N/S and he’s too busy dancing. In part, and it’s frustrating, this is the way running games work these days. So often HB’s don’t receive the handoff moving forward. It’s a handoff from a standstill out the shotgun.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2021 13:00:48 GMT -5
For the most part yes, but too many times there is no hole to hit fast. How many times is the defense filling gaps and there are more defenders than blockers. Nobody fears our passing game so the defense first read is the run thus loading the box. SB sometimes needs to cut before he even reaches the OL. I too would just plow ahead and get what I could get. I think thats pretty much what he is doing. I don't know if were trying more trap blocks to spring him or trying to bull foward and get to the 2nd level. I just don't know what to do. But what were doing it's not working. If were not doing what we did for Gallman last year please lets try that. you’re correct about the OL and holes yet we’ve all seen times where should be running N/S and he’s too busy dancing. In part, and it’s frustrating, this is the way running games work these days. So often HB’s don’t receive the handoff moving forward. It’s a handoff from a standstill out the shotgun. The 1st few games there were times (pointed out by baldy) he needed to cut right where there was a big hole and he just lowered his head and got his 2 yards running into the congestion..
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Post by Rangers13 on Dec 1, 2021 13:03:51 GMT -5
you’re correct about the OL and holes yet we’ve all seen times where should be running N/S and he’s too busy dancing. In part, and it’s frustrating, this is the way running games work these days. So often HB’s don’t receive the handoff moving forward. It’s a handoff from a standstill out the shotgun. The 1st few games there were times (pointed out by baldy) he needed to cut right where there was a big hole and he just lowered his head and got his 2 yards running into the congestion.. I remember and good call. He seems used to doing his own thing.
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Post by krappdetector on Dec 1, 2021 13:14:52 GMT -5
At this point even if his fans are right about WHY he has not lived up to expectations, does it really matter? IMO if he simply equaled his rookie performance he would STILL be behind the arc of his career here. Barkley is a good guy but was an inappropriate pick in 2018; it would be folly to double down on a contract extension now. He and the Giants would fare better to move on.
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Post by giantlegacy on Dec 1, 2021 13:18:54 GMT -5
Nailed it. Remember when Denver was churning out 1000 yard RBs like it was nothing? Literally taking undrafted dudes off a naval ship and having them rush for 1000 yards that season. Then when those dudes were coveted and signed by other teams they ended up being trash and out of the league quickly. It was the OL talent and zone blocking scheme. Not the RBs. And speaking of Derrick Henry... out for the season.Will be back for playoffs.. That's if they make the playoffs (a lot of tough games left and half their offensive skill position players are hurt )
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Post by DandyDon on Dec 1, 2021 13:22:14 GMT -5
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Post by Rangers13 on Dec 1, 2021 13:26:06 GMT -5
. . . but Barkley was the BAP in the draft
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Post by DandyDon on Dec 1, 2021 14:17:25 GMT -5
. . . but Barkley was the BAP in the draft Well, the article is more about re-signing to a big contact than drafting. But I didn't want him at #2 either.
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Post by Rangers13 on Dec 1, 2021 14:28:54 GMT -5
. . . but Barkley was the BAP in the draft Well, the article is more about re-signing to a big contact than drafting. But I didn't want him at #2 either. yeah, the risk is great and i think we’re all confident he’s going to do really well somewhere. Might only be for a few short years yet we can see him as a disruptive force.
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Post by Blue Hulk on Dec 1, 2021 15:17:26 GMT -5
Saquon is a bust.
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Post by DandyDon on Dec 6, 2021 10:48:56 GMT -5
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Post by OrangeGiant on Dec 6, 2021 10:59:16 GMT -5
Hard to argue much with what he said unfortunately...
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Post by FaceAcrossTheFloor on Dec 6, 2021 11:41:17 GMT -5
Barkley just doesn't seem to be a true NFL caliber back. Most good and great backs in the league initiate contact and occasionally break one. That is where the term "break one" comes from. Saquan seems to spend too much time searching for daylight. He also quickly looks to get out of bounds when possible.
I would love to see what he could be on a team like the Chiefs or Pats It is hard to believe that he is possibly as bad as he looks with the physical talent he possesses.
He is clearly not interested in contact. Whether he is mindful of past injuries or just making business decisions I have no idea.
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Post by DJones19 on Dec 6, 2021 11:43:37 GMT -5
I thought Saquon looked fine yesterday outside of the dropped ball. He's running more north and south.
Barkley converted on both 4th down attempts, I think. Taking 1 up the middle and dragging defenders 3 yards upfield.
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te88
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Post by te88 on Dec 6, 2021 12:37:01 GMT -5
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Post by Bigjeep on Dec 6, 2021 13:13:35 GMT -5
He will never be the same after that Injury! It's Victor Cruz all over again!
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Post by Rangers13 on Dec 6, 2021 13:15:17 GMT -5
He will never be the same after that Injury! It's Victor Cruz all over again! ? Cruz couldn’t run, this guy chooses not to. I don’t see the connection.
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Post by jb456 on Dec 6, 2021 13:21:55 GMT -5
He will never be the same after that Injury! It's Victor Cruz all over again! It's sad but I don't even think Barkley is worth the 5th year option at this point. The guy is living off his rookie season and that's almost 4 seasons ago. During his rookie season, it looked like almost no one could bring this guy down 1v1. Since then, I've seen this guy get tackled by his jersey or a gentle breeze. I understand why DG made the pick at the time but this was a horrible investment that has given the Giants almost no return on the #2 pick....
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Post by Rangers13 on Dec 6, 2021 13:32:12 GMT -5
If Miami can’t stand Tua, a player so many loved, would anybody opt for a Tua for Barkley straight up?
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Post by Roosevelt on Dec 6, 2021 13:40:21 GMT -5
I tend to agree that while all these RB's are not as dynamic a runner as Barkley, they did seem to be more consistently productive no matter which Oline we had.
Meh. This is just impatience with how bad we suck. Getting it out of the way, resigning Barkley makes no sense at this point. But he lists all those backs as if that group proves some point. It’s like high school debate antics 101. Barkley hasn’t lived up to the hype. But that “enough excuses” BS I have no patience for. It’s how the simple deny reality and demand what they want regardless of factual limitations. We lost 14 yards on an end-around last game, not because of the WR. Our horrible o line is not an excuse. It’s just a fact. It doesn’t make Barkley good. I don't think this is impatience. We've seen enough. Saquon is not the answer. He was a huge mistake.
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Post by allnygin on Dec 6, 2021 13:44:38 GMT -5
Barkley is no where near the player Gettlemen envisioned. WHY THE HELL are you drafting a RB with the number 2 overall pick when your oline was a shitshow at the time.. and still is!
Clueless organization this is a prime example of that.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 6, 2021 13:50:16 GMT -5
If Miami can’t stand Tua, a player so many loved, would anybody opt for a Tua for Barkley straight up? I was a fan of his and I thought I was finally wrong about a player but then he got my letter explaining to him about this and has now stepped up his game big time. Still an injury waiting to happen though..
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Post by Kruunch on Dec 6, 2021 14:02:00 GMT -5
If Miami can’t stand Tua, a player so many loved, would anybody opt for a Tua for Barkley straight up? I was a fan of his and I thought I was finally wrong about a player but then he got my letter explaining to him about this and has now stepped up his game big time. Still an injury waiting to happen though.. His bones are made of glass, and his soft tissue is that of paper-mache. His one strength was his ability to run, now he’s petrified to do so. He wants to be Steve Young, with the arm of Tim Tebow.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 6, 2021 14:04:50 GMT -5
I was a fan of his and I thought I was finally wrong about a player but then he got my letter explaining to him about this and has now stepped up his game big time. Still an injury waiting to happen though.. His bones are made of glass, and his soft tissue is that of paper-mache. His one strength was his ability to run, now he’s petrified to do so. He wants to be Steve Young, with the arm of Tim Tebow. That's an injustice calling him Tebow. He certainly throws guys open and into some very tight windows..
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